phosphatidylserine - how much to take?

[altostrata]

I am finding 2 capsules of Seriphos to be effective. It seems to take some time, maybe an hour, to work, but it is helping me to sleep.

[altostrata]

Talked to my integrative doc yesterday. He says Seriphos is safe to take by the handful (I wouldn't do this -- you may get a bad effect from the magnesium). You can take 2, 3, 4 capsules at a time, whatever works for you.

He is confident it opposes cortisol.

He also said the baby aspirin would be effective opposing cortisol for up to 6 hours and told me to take it before bed to keep the cortisol level low from the start of my sleep cycle.

My before-bed regime is now 2 Seriphos, 7.5mg DHEA, 15mg zinc, 1 baby aspirin. If I wake up, I take 2 more Seriphos and 2 milk peptide capsules. With a high-tryptophan whey protein shake, this seems to be working to improve my sleep.

[altostrata]

My doc is now recommending I take lecithin to augment the phosphatidylserine derived from the supplement Seriphos.

Lecithin contains phosphatidylcholine and phosphatidylinositol, which convert to phosphatidylserine.

He recommended taking NOW brand. I put a tablespoon in my cereal in the morning and in my whey protein in the evening. It doesn't have much taste, maybe a little buttery. It's relatively inexpensive.

I've only been taking it for about a week but it does seem to be calming. (See more details in http://paxilprogress.org/forums/show...833#post414833 )

[new dude 1985]

is it ok to take PS while withdrawling from Paxil?

[silence4now]

Are you completely off Paxil? if so, it shouldn't hurt you to try it. Start at 100 mg once a day and see how it works for you. It's very similar to fish oil in how it works, but it's derived from soybeans.

[new dude 1985]

well no... im down to 4mg but PS has helped me alot in terms of depression and focus. i dont seem to have any sides

[altostrata]

I absolutely recommend the lecithin, a good source of ps. Takes about a month at two tablespoons per day but is definitely calming.

[westeewoman]

Hi, Alto. Did the PS help with your cognitive function as well?

[altostrata]

Hi, Westee -- not that I could tell.

[pboy]

Any updates on this? I take soya lechithin that contains choline but not sure if it's the same thing? I take 2 capsules per day that each contain: 1,200mg soya lechithin, which provides 420mg phosphatidyl choline per capsule.

This is all so confusing

[silence4now]

Phosphatidyl serine and phosphatidyl choline are both phospholipids but do different things. I suggest doing your own research on this so you understand what you're taking and why. I think a lot of people found PS to help but it just depends on what you need. It does oppose cortisol so if you have adrenal problems it's tricky.

[altostrata]

My current doctor just recommended I try phosphatidylserine to subtly turn down my cortisol level and help my sleep. One capsule at breakfast to start and then another at lunch, depending on result.

I have some Seriphos from Oct 2007, am checking with the manufacturer (T.E. Neesby) to make sure it is still good. If it is, I'll take that.

As with all supplements, I have to watch for a paradoxical result from taking too much.

[altostrata]

Talked to a nice woman at Neesby (559-433-3110). She said the product is very stable and should last 4 years.

Might be a good idea to keep it in the fridge.

[altostrata]

Description of Seriphos from Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/InterPlexus-In...dp/B000N23AE8:

Ingredients per capsule: Each capsule supplies 90 mg of serine phosphate as a calcium and magnesium derivative in a base of calcium and magnesium ethanolamine phosphate. Mineral nutrients provided are elemental Calcium 45 mg, Magnesium 45 mg and Phosphorous 190 mg.

Properties: Clinically, Serine phosphate derivatives are better absorbed when ethanolamine salts are included.

Serine phosphate derivatives are believed to help optimize brain neurotransmissions with specific reference to hypothalmic-pituitary area. It also exerts a beneficial effect on memory retention and recall by stimulating morphogenetic neuronal plasticity which delays or prevents age dependent neurotransmitter function deterioration or decline.

Clinical Applications & Indications: Research indicates that serine phosphate derivatives can reverse hypothalmic-pituitary resistance to cortisol feedback in cases of cortisol hypersecretion. It is also indicated in conditions of memory deficit. Indicated in cognitive decline, senile dementia and mild cases of Alzheimer's disease.

Restrictions: Should not be given simultaneously with adrenergic agonists or alkaloid stimulants.

[altostrata]

Info about Seriphos from a specialty "life extension" supplement site http://www.paxilprogress.org/forums/...splay.php?f=16 (they don't seem to carry Seriphos anymore; they have their own phosphatidylserine):

"...SeriPhos is an economical way to obtain the benefits of phosphatidylserine. I dont know of any secret ingredient in the product or any reason why it should not be taken on a continuous basis. Its action I believe is to act as a cortisol receptor sensitizer like Phosphatidylserine. In that regard it improves adrenal function and the bodys response to its own cortisol. However it does not raise cortisol levels nor does it cause adrenal suppression as long term cortisol use would do. I will look further into this to confirm my understanding of the ingredients and mechanism of action. In the meantime I believe you can safely and beneficially continue to take SeriPhos as you had been doing. I will get back to you with the results of our inquiries. Ward Dean M.D."

[altostrata]

Abstract at http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...m&ordinalpos=8

Stress. 2004 Jun;7(2):119-26.

Effects of soy lecithin phosphatidic acid and phosphatidylserine complex (PAS) on the endocrine and psychological responses to mental stress.

Hellhammer J, Fries E, Buss C, Engert V, Tuch A, Rutenberg D, Hellhammer D.

Neuropattern, Trier, Germany. juliane.hellhammer@uni-trier.de

Phosphatidylserine, derived from cow brains, has been shown previously to dampen the ACTH and cortisol response to physical stress. Further research investigated the influence of soy lecithin phosphatidylserine supplementation on mood and heart rate when faced with an acute stressor. In this study, we investigated the effects of soy lecithin phosphatidic acid and phosphatidylserine complex (PAS) supplementation on pituitary adrenal reactivity (ACTH, cortisol) and on the psychological response (Spielberger State Anxiety Inventory stress subscale) to a mental and emotional stressor. Four groups of 20 subjects were treated for three weeks with daily dosages of either 400 mg PAS, 600 mg PAS, 800 mg PAS, or placebo before exposure to the Trier Social Stress Test (TSST). Treatment with 400 mg PAS resulted in a pronounced blunting of both serum ACTH and cortisol, and salivary cortisol responses to the TSST, but did not affect heart rate. The effect was not seen with larger doses of PAS. With regard to the psychological response, 400 mg PAS seemed to exert a specific positive effect on emotional responses to the TSST. While the placebo group showed the expected increase in distress after the test, the group treated with 400 mg PAS showed decreased distress. These data provide initial evidence for a selective stress dampening effect of PAS on the pituitary-adrenal axis, suggesting the potential of PAS in the treatment of stress related disorders.