Suicidal, please help

[Glaucus]

Hi Bilo

I am so sorry for what you are going through. We share many of the same symptoms, especially the burning nerves which has to be one of the worst. I was on SSRIs for twenty years and I'm afraid I have to do my time. Yes we can be v v bad for a v v long time, but it does eventually get better. We just have to hold on somehow until then. You have shown great resilience by not reinstating, despite feeling constantly like you have to give up. I empathise so much - so many times I have thrown myself to the floor and cried out that I can't go on any longer, that I must reinstate or go to hospital or do anything to alleviate the suffering.

But the harsh truth is that there is nothing except the crapshoot of reinstating. And the odds, as you know, are not good - and what could be worse than being even worse and back on the drugs? I couldn't take it.

So we have to grin and bear it. And while my symptoms have not yet turned the corner I have got better at dealing with it. I don't throw myself to the floor so often, I no longer call my parents and tell them I want to end it - I've learned that it doesn't really help and just upsets everyone.

One thing to note - in my experience you really need to count the start of your healing from the date of the last drug, in your case a benzo. As I'm sure you know wd from benzos is every bit as devastating as SSRIs - like me you are probably suffering from a double whammy. I also tried to take a rescue dose a couple of times and while it gave me a tiny bit of relief, I felt much worse afterwards. And then I would ruminate about whether it had set my healing back...

So I strongly urge you not to take the odd oxazepam, I'm sure it won't help only hinder...

I've also reasonably certain - from your description of symptoms - that you are going through a classic withdrawal, and that you will find that whatever you had previously will pale into insignificance once you recover. I've seen this again and again and again. Try not to look for other diagnoses - it is withdrawal, withdrawal, withdrawal.

Lastly have you called any helplines? There are some really good one's here in the UK that help people coming off these drugs. They are a lifeline for me. Try Bristol and District Tranquiliser Project, also Recovery Road. You will hear more comforting stories from them. They will take international calls, especially Recovery Road.

Meanwhile, keep going, I can see that you have the strength to do this and not be fooled into some new diagnosis. And while the suffering may continue a while you will get much better at coping with it... just avoid all those nasty drugs if you possibly can.

Luke

[Bilo76]

Luke,

Thanks for your upbeat and nice reply.
I hope you are right and that this is WD. However you took an ssro cause of a bad reaction to an operation. I took it because i had insane anxiety when i was 21 and even spend 5 months in a CBT clinic in order to beat my anxiety disorder (thats why i started paxil). STILL i hope you are right.

No helpline here in holland i am afraid. I will look into recovery road.

I do take an oxazepam now and then (once every week). I will try to stop with that. All though i have the feeling stopping from a benzo wasnt really hard for me. But who knows. Thanks for the tip

Luke,...you are now off ADs for 20 months. Did the symptoms approved at least a bit for you? Are you able to see friends, sport, work?

[Glaucus]

Biko I really urge you to stop the oxazepam completely. At best it gives you a tiny bit of very temporary relief. But each time you take one you are giving your nervous system a shock which is the last thing it needs. I know many expert counsellors here in the UK who would say that it delays your overall healing.

Yes do call Recovery Road, they are really kind and have all been through it. But they will also strongly suggest you don't take a rescue benzo!

No I can't see friends or work etc. Perhaps if the burning / electric current sensations weren't so bad. I have days when I can do some things, and I am planning to go to Colorado with my family in August.

But again I was on various SSRIs for twenty years, so my system is taking a while to readjust. It probably won't be so long for you.

And yes I've seen countless stories of people who had v v bad anxiety only to find it goes away after going through withdrawal. The journey itself will help with coping skills, and any residual anxiety will be a walk in the park compared to what you have been through.

[julie-d]

Bilo,
Glad to see you back. I'm sorry you're having such a hard time, but I agree with Songbird. You've only been med-free for a very short time (since May), and it sounds like everything you're experiencing is common with Paxil w/d. I've experienced most of it myself. It's horrific, but in my experience and many others here, it gets better with time. It's the hardest thing I've ever gone through in my life, and probably yours too. The only thing that kept me from reinstating during the worst of w/d was not wanting everything I've been through to be for naught and not wanting to ever have to go through it again. There's nothing worse than anxiety. It's awful. I hope you get at least a window of relief soon.
Julie

Originally Posted by Songbird

I read it all, don't worry! I don't know if this helps at all, but everything you describe is classic paxil withdrawal. From what you are saying, you had pretty bad w/d symptoms already while still on Paxil? So it may not be worth trying to reinstate if you were already feeling very bad on it. Only you can really decide that. BTW, what did you mean earlier about CHV?

I wouldn't worry too much about how much your anxiety is original versus withdrawal. At this point, a lot of your stuff is going to be from withdrawal, but regardless of the cause, you can treat your anxiety with the same techniques. Don't try to fight it, fighting it is exhausting. Do you have Claire Weekes's books? I can't remember if I've already sent you the mp3 files I have, but if not you can PM me if you would like them.

The sensory overload is not unusual. I think the key is to find a balance you can handle. Staying all day in a dark room is definitely not healthy, but pushing yourself too hard isn't either. Try to do something each day, even if you only go outside for five minutes, if that's all you can handle right now. Avoid any scary TV or books, be very gentle with your nervous system.

With the rumination and repeating thoughts, again, fighting them will exhaust you and doesn't work. A better way is to learn to stand aside in your mind and be an independent observer, just watch it happening without judging. You can even say to yourself "oh, there goes that repeating thought thing again". This gets easier the more you practise it.

If you decide to ride it out without meds, remember it is early days (your signature says off meds only since May 1. It will get better. I've been on this forum for quite a few years now and have seen others go through the same thing and recover. Remember we are all here for you. Keep checking in!

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by luke

Biko I really urge you to stop the oxazepam completely. At best it gives you a tiny bit of very temporary relief. But each time you take one you are giving your nervous system a shock which is the last thing it needs. I know many expert counsellors here in the UK who would say that it delays your overall healing.

No I can't see friends or work etc. Perhaps if the burning / electric current sensations weren't so bad. I have days when I can do some things, and I am planning to go to Colorado with my family in August.

But again I was on various SSRIs for twenty years, so my system is taking a while to readjust. It probably won't be so long for you.

but what do you do when your mind simply cant take it no more? That you are 1 step away from the hospital. I then take a benzo cause i figured that much strain to the mind (repeating words and suicide thoughts over and over in my mind, every noice of light is to much etc etc) is worse then a benzo.
Isnt that true?

What did you do last couple of months luke? I hate it to be in the house or at my parents this much. Days pass by very quicly and one day is a copy of the next. however i keep going to the store, cycle and walk a bit every day. It gives me massive anxiety and sometimes panic attack but otherwise i would do nothing.

You were on ssris for 20 years, for me it was 14,5 years. I doubt that makes difference haha. but i hope i will heal a bit quicker then you yes (no offense ;-) )

[Honeysuckle]

Hi Bilo,

I'm happy to see that you are ok...

I just wanted to follow up from what Songbird has said::

I wouldn't worry too much about how much your anxiety is original versus withdrawal. At this point, a lot of your stuff is going to be from withdrawal, but regardless of the cause, you can treat your anxiety with the same techniques. Don't try to fight it, fighting it is exhausting. Do you have Claire Weekes's books? I can't remember if I've already sent you the mp3 files I have, but if not you can PM me if you would like them.

The sensory overload is not unusual. I think the key is to find a balance you can handle. Staying all day in a dark room is definitely not healthy, but pushing yourself too hard isn't either. Try to do something each day, even if you only go outside for five minutes, if that's all you can handle right now. Avoid any scary TV or books, be very gentle with your nervous system.

With the rumination and repeating thoughts, again, fighting them will exhaust you and doesn't work. A better way is to learn to stand aside in your mind and be an independent observer, just watch it happening without judging. You can even say to yourself "oh, there goes that repeating thought thing again". This gets easier the more you practise it.

I have been doing a lot of work and getting relief these last few weeks for my anxiety from Bronwyn Fox-her MP3's, book, and I think most importantly, the DVD's of her workshops which are aimed at those of us with Anxiety disorder. It's often hard to read when I'm anxious, but watching DVD is fine-it;s not too stimulating and for me, comforting. SHe impresses and teaches the importance of like what a lot of others say- to not get caught up in the anxiety (I know easier said than done) and don't fight it.

I also do phone counselling with her. I am beginning to realise even though the anxiety and other side effects (including the adrenaline dumps which I think you also get) I have now coming off Aropax are way worse than what I went on Aropax for - it doesn't matter. It's all manageable and we can recover. Her story is amazing. http://www.panicattacks.com.au/bkstore/index.html

I sometimes have to take a 2mg valium (two in about 10 weeks) when the agitation and anxiety is so bad that I want to die and the feeling will not let up. It's my choice and although others may recommend not to use a benzo-I felt like it was the best thing for me to do at the time. And that's all you can do whilst on this journey=what's best for you.

Take care

**edit-sorry not quite sure yet how to do the quote thing***

Bilo, I am straight, but I have to say you are a good-looking dude!

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by ElVito1981

Bilo, I am straight, but I have to say you are a good-looking dude!

You have a sister?

thanks man. But honestly i dont care at this moment. I wish i was ugly but happy.

[jcsneddon]

hi bilo
sorry to hear you are having such a difficult time. i know this feeling that this is not withdrawal but the real me coming back. Every time i drop a dose I have bad anxiety and suicidal thoughts etc and EVERY time i think it is the real me coming back and then it passes. I think you did a very quick drop. am i right? my symptoms are bad enough with a slow taper so i can only imagine what it is like with a fast drop (actually i know what it was like as i have done a fast drop before and it was hell on earth). anyway i am not sure if the option is there for u to reinstate and then do a slow wean? just so life can be bearable again? you shouldn't have to feel so terrible.

i keep worrying that the real me is this anxious wreck but actually i wasn't anxious all the time and now i have CBT which is proven to work better than SSRI! so every time i feel rubbish i tell myself this and i keep persevering.

i hope u get some relief soon, take care
jo

[axis74]

Hi Bilo I' am sending you good energy and hoping you feel better. You are going through a drug withdrawal that is why you are having the suicidal urges it is very important that you wait it out and not do anything it will pass u need to get off of the medication because that is what is doing this to u and just rest and wait. good luck

Originally Posted by Bilo76

You have a sister?

thanks man. But honestly i dont care at this moment. I wish i was ugly but happy.

Yeah, but they're all older haha.

You'll be happy again--it'll just take some time and suffering to get there. You, like me, were on SSRIs for a long time. And that has changed our brains, so it'll take a while for the brain to undo all those changes.

In the meantime, try your best to get as much sunshine as possible (directly into your eyes--no sunglasses), get enough omega 3s (EPA and DHA), exercise at least 5 times a week, sleep 7-9 hours a day, and go on some dates! Even if you struggle, it's better to struggle while going out and doing stuff than not doing anything at all.

Also, I recommend reading "Depression in Contagious" by Michael Yapko. He's a brilliant guy.

[Songbird]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

but what do you do when your mind simply cant take it no more? That you are 1 step away from the hospital. I then take a benzo cause i figured that much strain to the mind (repeating words and suicide thoughts over and over in my mind, every noice of light is to much etc etc) is worse then a benzo.
Isnt that true?

It really won't hurt you. The more you react to it and fear it, the stronger it may get. I know it is hard to do, but practising standing back in your mind and observing it helps to lead to acceptance, and it won't bother you as much. Sometimes when things are really driving you crazy it can help to invite it by saying "Come on then, do your worst! See if I care!" It might sound strange, but this technique can work quite well. It is like telling your mind that no matter what happens, you can handle it, thus removing your fear.

Another thing you could try instead of taking a benzo is doing some relaxation exercises. I know it doesn't sound like much, I remember when I would read here people writing about relaxation exercises and I wasn't very convinced - then when I crashed they pretty much saved my life. They were so much more effective than I'd expected. So now I recommend them here all the time!

Originally Posted by Bilo76

Days pass by very quicly and one day is a copy of the next. however i keep going to the store, cycle and walk a bit every day. It gives me massive anxiety and sometimes panic attack but otherwise i would do nothing.

This is good, keep doing these things, to the level you can handle. Claire Weekes has some good advice about having anxiety when going to the store, etc. If you find noise and bright light too stimulating, then try to avoid them for most of the day, but try to get out a little bit in ways you can handle. Be gentle with your system, but don't shut yourself away in a dark room the whole time, you need to find a good balance that works for you.

[alivehope]

When you thinking of suicide, your thinking is blurred and influenced by depressive feelings which are not rational. If you feel you are seriously at risk of suicide, go to hospital or stay with parents and tell them about your issues.

[wanting2quit]

Hi Bilo! Just wanted to pop in and say how glad I am that you are okay. I have been praying for you, and will continue to do so.

I also wanted to say that I have been where you are, but I was also newly pregnant. Try going through 9 months of pregnancy while in w/d. No fun. If it weren't for the new life in me, I'm not sure I would have made it. Suicidal? Yep, I was, and had NEVER been before Paxil w/d. Obsessed with death and dying and terrified with dying, even though I was having suicidal thoughts? I went through that too. I am 5'10" and was only 118 pounds thanks to Paxil w/d and stomach issues when I found out I was pregnant. I made it through though. You will too.

Yes, I did end up having PPD after my daughter was born, but I got through that too... even though at the time I didn't think I would. I remember praying to God to just let me get through the night and be able to see another day. It is so hard for me even now to type that and relive those memories.

What you are experiencing is w/d. I'd bet money on it. With that said though, if you need to go back on meds, do it. I have, with the intention of getting back off them at some point, and now I am at that point. Now that I am doing a slow wean, I am feeling better about being med free than I ever have. Does it still suck? Hell yes. Is it fair? Absolutely not. Is it difficult? The most difficult thing I have ever done.

Like you, I have gotten totally discouraged from time to time by the horror stories here. But for the first time in years, I am seeing a light at the end of the tunnel. I am choosing to have faith in the success stories here, and there are some amazing ones. You and I, and many others have already been through hell. It's time to find our path back, and have faith and hope in our bodies, and in the power of healing. And whichever way you choose to get yourself on that path, whether it be meds or not, we'll be here to support you all the way. Will it probably suck a** some days, weeks, even months? Maybe. But we'll be here when that happens too, and we'll be here to cheer you on when you post your success story someday, even though right now you may feel that will never happen. It will. Not tomorrow, maybe not even next year, but it will!

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by akaenew

Bilo, what I experienced was inhuman, for a very long time. I relate so well to what you write and your symptoms, that I can barely read it. But is does get better- for some reason more slowly for some people than for others. In three weeks I will be 6 years off paxil and it has been worth it.

I cry when I read what you are going through, so innocent- all for taking a drug that was precribed to us in our full faith of good outcomes. For what it is worth, I will be pulling for you. peace to you, akaenew

Akaenew,

I read all of your threads from 2006 till now. What a horrible couple of years you have had. I recommend everyone here on this forum to read it and to see how it ends well. I have great respect for you.
This post to my thread is your first post in 2 years and i feel very honored (i know its silly but still) that you replied to me.
I send you a pm. I am hoping you have the time and spirit to read it.

God bless ya

Remco