question on restart of SSRI and possible hypersensitivity

[healthguy123]

Hi, I wanted to tap into the expertise of the forum in terms of my situation. I am 30/M diagnosed with GAD, severe performance anxiety, and Panic Disorder. 4 years back I was put on zoloft by GP. No side effects at all and stayed on it for a few months, got up to 50 MG, then quit cold turkey because it wasnt doing anything for my anxiety. No side effects at all when I quit. Was ok for like a year or so, then anxiety came back pretty bad, Went back to GP to restart zoloft, had horrendous side effects off of 25 MG from day 1. Off of one dose, the worst nausea, anxiety, panic, and insomnia I had ever experienced. To me it was unbearable, I could not be in public with these side effects. Even 0.5 mg of klonopin couldnt calm down the anxiety and panic. Had to take a week off from work just to get back to a normal mental state. Went back to GP and was prescribed ativan 0.5 mg and propranolol 10-20 mg as needed for panic. These work pretty good (no side effects), but I cant take the ativan during the day due to excessive drowsiness that makes it difficult to function at work.

The problem is that my anxiety is fairly constant and I think I need something more regular to function. Went to 2 Pdocs in the past 2 years - one diagnosed with bipolar type II (which I think isnt correct based on my own analysis of my symptoms), the other confirmed the original diagnosis of GAD, performance anxiety, and Panic. The latter wants me to start lexapro at 5 mg. Part of me wants to try this as it might be a good choice, but I am literally petrified based off of my bad experience with one low dose zoloft the second time. I could not even function and I work in an extreme high stress, low pay environment where they are looking to get rid of people. So, I dont want to risk being nonproductive for weeks until the side effects pass (maybe). I am thinking I might be hypersensitive to SSRI's now for some reason - what do you think?

[scotty]

It's not unusual to find that after one use period of an ssri that a restart doesn't have the same results. I don't know what the mechanism is behind it, but it's fairly common.

What else have you done to deal with the anxiety?

[texgirl]

Lexapro is usually a poor choice for anxiety sufferers, as it tends to be stimulating. I took it for awhile with no problems, but when I tried to restart it years later I had an adverse reaction just from one pill.

Why did they switch you from Klonopin to Ativan? The half-life of Ativan is much shorter, so the dose wears off and you get rebound symptoms much quicker.

[Macadamia]

Some random thoughts - 50mg Zoloft is not a therapeutic dose. Most people take something like 100-150mg.

25mg is not a low starting dose if you're sensitive. Half or a quarter of that would be better.

When I restarted Zoloft I did have more trouble than originally. I did 12.5 mg increments and got back up to 150mg. It took about 3 months I think.

I agree on clonezepam vs. ativan. I had similar problems to what you're describing with the short acting Xanax.

The propanolol is a beta blocker. My mom took that for heart palpitations and a too fast heart beat.

Here are some non medication suggestions to try - EFT (emotional freedom technique). Works well for me for panic attacks.

Look into MTHFR mutations and a poorly functioning methylation cycle. I have these. I'm planning on getting off Zoloft and then addressing these mutations with supplements, which should fix my neurotransmitter problems. MTHFR.net is a good place to start.

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by Macadamia

Look into MTHFR mutations and a poorly functioning methylation cycle. I have these. I'm planning on getting off Zoloft and then addressing these mutations with supplements, which should fix my neurotransmitter problems. MTHFR.net is a good place to start.

Sorry but MTHFR.net looks like a scam

[Bruno2006]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

Sorry but MTHFR.net looks like a scam

The bottome line is that many people have been helped by optimizng or "fixing" a poor methylation cycle and while it may not be the answer for all, it is for some.

[Backtopaxil]

I was on paxil for 8 years, stopped it for two weeks ( after a fast taper) and RI but it was hell. Lots of physical symptoms. Till this day , I dont know why my body rejected it so vehemently.

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by Bruno2006

The bottome line is that many people have been helped by optimizng or "fixing" a poor methylation cycle and while it may not be the answer for all, it is for some.

Yes off course. Lets buy this mans 150$ tester and his methods. Cause i am sure its a help against autism, down syndrome, a stroke, bipolar disorder, miscarriages, parkinsons, anxiety, alzheimer, epilepsy, blood clots etc etc etc

http://mthfr.net/mthfr-mutations-and...se/2011/09/07/

All caused by the MTHFR gene mutations.

LMFAO



The bottom line is that this website is a scam. But i quote this inventor "it's very cheap to find out if you have this problem, just mail me 150$ for the tester and find out"

[julleri]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

Yes off course. Lets buy this mans 150$ tester and his methods. Cause i am sure its a help against autism, down syndrome, a stroke, bipolar disorder, miscarriages, parkinsons, anxiety, alzheimer, epilepsy, blood clots etc etc etc

http://mthfr.net/mthfr-mutations-and...se/2011/09/07/

All caused by the MTHFR gene mutations.

LMFAO



The bottom line is that this website is a scam. But i quote this inventor "it's very cheap to find out if you have this problem, just mail me 150$ for the tester and find out"

Bilo,

MTHFR gene mutations are real and people suffer from it. It CAN cause the things listed.

Anyone can go out to a doctor and request a genetics test for this polymorphism. It's roughly $100 or so without American health insurance. One can choose to test from this doctor or not. I'd personally rather try to have a personal doctor test me over this guy. But just because what you see on this website is some random guy charging $150 for a genetic test with which you're not familiar does not make it a "scam."

Jason

[Bilo76]

I am sorry but i am not a believer jason. If you are thats fine!! But my alarm goes off when:

1.) Someone is offering a cure from the plague to homosexuality
2.) There is a world changing diet but i havent heard about it
3.) There is some weird looking guy saying this
4.) His website is made from a free .php layout (i recognize it; i used it for scams)
5.) Somebody that calls 150$ almost no money
6.) The website says:
"i offer phone consultations as i find it important to help as many people as possible"

and then i read further on very well hidden "Consultations are $300 per hour"
Well how generous of him

Seriously;.this website smells scam all over it

But again;...try it!! If you believe in it then perhaps its the cure for your depression and WD.

[julleri]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

I am sorry but i am not a believer jason. If you are thats fine!! But my alarm goes off when:

1.) Someone is offering a cure from the plague to homosexuality
2.) There is a world changing diet but i havent heard about it
3.) There is some weird looking guy saying this
4.) His website is made from a free .php layout (i recognize it; i used it for scams)
5.) Somebody that calls 150$ almost no money
6.) The website says:
"i offer phone consultations as i find it important to help as many people as possible"

and then i read further on very well hidden "Consultations are $300 per hour"
Well how generous of him

Seriously;.this website smells scam all over it

But again;...try it!! If you believe in it then perhaps its the cure for your depression and WD.

Look, I'm not saying the site isn't seedy as hell. It is. I'm arguing your disbelief in MTHFR errors.

[Macadamia]

Actually MTHFR mutations are just the tip of the iceberg in the methylation cycle, but it's very complex so that's why I suggested that particular website as a starting point. There is a lot of good information on the website, but you don't have to buy from that guy.

You can get a MTHFR test from any major lab. This test is used for expectant mothers to see if they need to supplement with additional folic acid so they have a healthy fetus.

If you have a MTHFR mutation, you will have a downregulation of 30% to 70% in your body's ability to convert folic acid from the diet into a form the body can actually use. This affects B12, DNA regulation, neurotransmitter production, glutathione, ATP (energy production) and so on. This can cause a whole host of problems in the body and there is a wide ranging list of health conditions associated with it.

However, just because you have the mutations doesn't necessarily mean you will get sick. You also need to encounter stress, viruses and toxins which overwhelm your body's ability to deal with them. But because you have the mutations you will get overwhelmed sooner than people who don't.

This explains why different people can encounter the same chemicals, for example, and some people are fine, while others get sick.

Maybe it explains why *we* are the ones to have problems with SSRI withdrawal, while for most others, it's no problem. I don't know that for sure, but I do know that I have these mutations.

This is a very new field which is why you have probably never heard of it. The Human Genome Project was just completed in 2003, and it takes about 17 years for information to go from research to your general practitioner.

[Bruno2006]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

Yes off course. Lets buy this mans 150$ tester and his methods. Cause i am sure its a help against autism, down syndrome, a stroke, bipolar disorder, miscarriages, parkinsons, anxiety, alzheimer, epilepsy, blood clots etc etc etc

http://mthfr.net/mthfr-mutations-and...se/2011/09/07/

All caused by the MTHFR gene mutations.

LMFAO



The bottom line is that this website is a scam. But i quote this inventor "it's very cheap to find out if you have this problem, just mail me 150$ for the tester and find out"

Again, the bottom line is that some people have benefited, some dramitically, from "fixing" their methylation cycle.

People come here for information, guidence, and other help as this person is doing here. We all have a right, as long as we follow rules, to give our recomendations and advice to people seeking information. For you to pick apart and attack what others say isn't only wrong and pointless, but quite annoying. You don't have to read what others say or believe it, but don't attack them. Tell me, what good did your little scam comment accomplish? Perhaps you uncovered the greatest scam in this century? Others don't believe it is a scam, so what makes you right?

If you want to debate a topic, PM the person. I'd be happy to back up my claims and beliefs and am open to discussion. Also, I know its ok to be wrong and no one has all the answers, including you. This thread now contains a bunch of usless crap and this is not what this forum is for.

[justme39]

Originally Posted by scotty

It's not unusual to find that after one use period of an ssri that a restart doesn't have the same results. I don't know what the mechanism is behind it, but it's fairly common.

What else have you done to deal with the anxiety?

I agree with that 100%. I am having my own issues with GAD and getting back on paxil- which did nothing for me but cause more problems. When I told my Dr that I had heard re starting a medication you were already on for a while might not work- he said " that is not true and I don't know where you get your information from' I am living proof it is true and most pdocs just don't know what goes on with these medications. I am super sensitive myself and I am still having a hard time. As far as the ativan please be careful. Take them when you really need them. Another mistake my pdoc made with me. If I may suggest a book that has been helping me- peace from nervous suffering by Dr. Claire Weekes. The book is 40 years old. The principals are the same and hit this issue right on the head.

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by julleri

Look, I'm not saying the site isn't seedy as hell. It is. I'm arguing your disbelief in MTHFR errors.

I never said that. Where did i say that? I believe my first comment was that this website is a scam. Please quote me where i said i dont belief in MTHFR errors? If you ask me about that;..well i think its just like the neurotransmitters theory. It might be true and i think a lot of wizdom can be gathered there, but that we needs years of studie before we can achieve something. All i said was that this website is a scam. i was trying to help. I am not proud to say i worked on some internet scams when i was a kid. So i recognize one. I just thought i mentioned it. Didnt realize you guys would be so upset by that ??

Originally Posted by Bruno2006

For you to pick apart and attack what others say isn't only wrong and pointless, but quite annoying. You don't have to read what others say or believe it, but don't attack them. Tell me, what good did your little scam comment accomplish? Perhaps you uncovered the greatest scam in this century? Others don't believe it is a scam, so what makes you right?
If you want to debate a topic, PM the person. I'd be happy to back up my claims and beliefs and am open to discussion. Also, I know its ok to be wrong and no one has all the answers, including you. This thread now contains a bunch of usless crap and this is not what this forum is for.

Bruno,..the most crap in this thread is yours. If you are so annoyed;..dont reply. Nobody asked you to. If we can discuss as grownups then i value your opinion. But you are not even reading my replies well. I never said anything about the large idea behind it. Again;...i only said the website is a scam. What good that comment did? Well i hoped it saved somebody 1000s of dollars.

Originally Posted by Bruno2006

We all have a right, as long as we follow rules, to give our recomendations and advice to people seeking information.

To be honest;..you are not following the rules. Have you even read this website bruno? This guy wants 300 $ per hour for advice on the phone, 150 $ for a test, 650 $ for a personal diet advice, and 1000$ to become part of some sort of sekt.
One of the most important rules of this forum is "do NOT link to commercial sites".

[Bruno2006]

Bilo,

Please take your own advice. Again, someone simply made a recommendation and you, as I have seen before, picked it apart and attacked it which is not fair to others. Just because you see this site as a scam, doesn't mean it is. And yes, I have visited the site which has a lot of useful information which, I believe, was the purpose of that person recommending it. Whats wrong with that? Why did you have to make a little comment that was pointless? You think you saved the day by saying that?

I am not touting this site or recommending it but simply standing up and supporting the other person who made a simple recommendation into searching for underlying causes of anxiety. With that said, the website is a source for info just as many other sites are and its not the type of commercial site that is only selling something, rather, it has a lot of useful info that may help SOME PEOPLE. If you believe this person broke the rules by recommending it, send an email to the mod, dont hijack the thread. I personally would not say to visit any site and this may have been breaking the rules by recommending it, but the point is leave the little pointless comments to yourself as it does nothing beneficial for us.

Now please, can we help this person here seeking info and stop getting side tracked?

[Bilo76]

You gotta be kidding me? Who is hijacking this thread? I was always commenting on this subject. You however was only commenting on me and my personal posts and way i post. You havent said a word about the subject at hand. So please follow your own advice and if you believe i somehow broke a rule or you have a problen with the way i post, pm a mod or myself. Cause you are making this into a personal attack and you arevthe one leaving the main subject. The site is a scam and i wanted to warn people about that. Now please can we get back to the subject?

[nicole55]

I tried another SSRI after being off of one.

When I orginally started Paxil I had a little bit of bothersome symptoms that went away pretty quick.

Years later (after making it off of Paxil with a slow taper) I was desperate with horrible anxiety(see my signature). I tried Zoloft. I was too afraid to go back on Paxil after having a hard time getting off. Well it didn't go well. Bad start up symptoms right away. I started low and was supposed to increase my dose a little, I did and things were just bad from the get go. It was about a month and I could't take it. They kept telling me the symptoms would level off, well they didn't. I just dropped it.

I don't know if it was a bad reaction to Zoloft in particular or just SSRI's in general .

It's up to you of course, but these meds have a lot of bad side effects. As much as mine helped me(the original SSRI), the side effects and bad withdrawal are too rough. You are lucky you escaped the bad withdrawal.

Have you worked on your GAD etc in other ways? If you haven't, I would look into therapy with a counselor, where you can learn all kinds of good techniques to minimize your symptoms. Also regular exercise. Do some reading, there are some great books that can help. And use your meds like Ativan sparingly as needed for when it's really bad. I personally don't want to be on any meds long term.

Good luck to you.

[Bruno2006]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

You gotta be kidding me? Who is hijacking this thread? I was always commenting on this subject. You however was only commenting on me and my personal posts and way i post. You havent said a word about the subject at hand. So please follow your own advice and if you believe i somehow broke a rule or you have a problen with the way i post, pm a mod or myself. Cause you are making this into a personal attack and you arevthe one leaving the main subject. The site is a scam and i wanted to warn people about that. Now please can we get back to the subject?

Actually, I wanted to recommend a few things for finding underlying issues of anxiety and the MTHFR thing was one of them but then I was side tracked by your comment because I have seen you do this before so had to call you out on it.

I have met people online who have had great success with using nutrients for undermethylation and so it doesnt hurt to throw that out there for others who are seeking info. I think its very important we all share our experience and knowledge with each other because I am of the belief that there are indeed underlying issues, whether on a biological level or psychological level, to our challenges.

[Macadamia]

Sorry for posting the wrong kind of link. I'm sure I read the rules before posting, but I didn't remember the thing about commercial links.

But yes, I am feeling rather attacked, and I'm considering whether I should continue posting on here. Most people on here seem to be hung up on their psych meds. There are other alternatives, which I'm versed in; so I feel like I have something valuable to offer. But I will gladly go elsewhere if this is going to be something that draws attacks.

[Bilo76]

Off course not macademia. This forum is not hung up on psych meds. And i can only speak for myself but i am always very interested in alternatives for anxiety. I am sorry if i made you feel attacked. I only posted one sentence that the site is a scam imo. Never wanted to attack you or your ideas. Please keep sharing your info with us

[julleri]

Originally Posted by Macadamia

Sorry for posting the wrong kind of link. I'm sure I read the rules before posting, but I didn't remember the thing about commercial links.

But yes, I am feeling rather attacked, and I'm considering whether I should continue posting on here. Most people on here seem to be hung up on their psych meds. There are other alternatives, which I'm versed in; so I feel like I have something valuable to offer. But I will gladly go elsewhere if this is going to be something that draws attacks.

Macadamia,

Can you enable private messaging in your profile options? I can't send you a private message and I'd like to.

Jason

[julleri]

Originally Posted by scotty

It's not unusual to find that after one use period of an ssri that a restart doesn't have the same results. I don't know what the mechanism is behind it, but it's fairly common.

It really is common, healthguy123. There's a wonderful thread on this site that I can't tell you how many times I've read. I think it should be a sticky (or this theme that reinstatement is a crapshoot should be made a sticky). It's located here: http://www.paxilprogress.org/forums/...ad.php?t=15540

I personally believe that over time our bodies somehow "learn" that SSRIs are toxic and for whatever reason, mechanism not understood as pointed out by Scotty, may react badly to them. Badly may be putting it mildly in some instances.

[Macadamia]

Originally Posted by julleri

Macadamia,

Can you enable private messaging in your profile options? I can't send you a private message and I'd like to.

Jason

Private messaging has been enabled.