I was fine until agoraphobia came back and slapped me in the face...please HELP!

[Vjune18]

Hello. I am new to this site, but I have been reading lots of posts every once in a while for the past couple of months. I decided to join and post so that I could get some advice as I am quite confused and starting to feel hopeless. I know this is going to be quite a long post, but I really hope some of you can take the time to read about my situation and try to help.
Just some background on me:

I started taking Paxil at a VERY young age for panic attacks. I would have anxiety and agoraphobia so bad that I would refuse to go to school and could not step foot in the cafeteria for a long time. Anyways, as soon as I started taking my highest dose of Paxil, all was well for about 8 years. I started to come to the conclusion that I did not want to be on this pill, or any other pill, for the rest of my life and wanted my body and mind to act as they were made to. I told my dr I wanted to come off and she said we needed to do it gradually. NEVER did she mention anything about withdrawal symptoms or side effects. As soon as I started lowering dosages, I could tell a difference but was so determined to get off. A couple weeks after taking my last Paxil last September, all hell broke loose. The major depression, crying spells out of nowhere, the headaches, the brain zaps, the mood changes, the suicidal thoughts; but I had no real panic attacks or anxiety about having a panic attack. Only the headaches and brain zaps lasted a few weeks, but the depression and crying last several months. Right around 4-5 months post Paxil, I seriously started thinking about reinstating just because I didn't want to deal with the hell I was going through anymore. But after reading plenty of posts on here and encouraging replies telling others that it gets better, I decided not to reinstate and just kept praying things would get better.

After plenty fights with my parents and boyfriend, I slowly started to feel "normal" again (I'm guessing just because I was afraid of losing people in my life that I love). I wasn't as depressed and angry anymore like I used to be. This somewhat happiness lasted about 3 months until....BOOM, agoraphobia/panic came and slapped me in the face. Literally. I started to feel funny one day as I was driving on the highway, sort of like a constant brain zap feeling. But only while I was driving, not anywhere else. I tried pushing it away for a few days hoping it would pass and get better. I actually started having other people drive some of the time. But one night on my way home I actually had a full blown panic attack on the road and had to pull over because I was so afraid of crashing my car. Ever since that night I have refused to drive on that road or any other "open" road such as highways or ones that I cannot pull over. It has been around 2.5-3 months now that I cannot drive very far. Over the past month my agoraphobia has been getting worse..it is now big stores I cannot go to. I even had a hard time visiting a water park last weekend because i was so full of anxiety for no reason!

I do apologize for the rambling. I guess my main question is will this ever get better??? I am starting to seriously think about getting on an anti-anxiety rather than anti-depressant because I was never even depressed to begin with to even be put on Paxil! I don't understand where this random anxiety is coming from..I totally fine for a few months! I am so full of anger inside and am feeling quite helpless. I have to fix this before August (I am a college student and have to drive to class). I could really use some helpful advice and LOTS of reassurance if anyone has any.

Once again I do apologize for such a long post and I thank all of you reading this in advance for taking the time to read this.

[Bilo76]

i wanted to pmed you. i been listening to some claire weekes mp3s and i think they might help you to. But your pm is off

[Brassmonkey]

Hi Vjune-- Welcome to the site. If you look around the site some more you'll find that this is not a long post. Don't worrie about saying what you have to say, most of the people here will read it, and many of those will offer advise/opinions, they are a really great bunch.

It looks to me like you are in the throws of WD from a too fast taper. Seven or eight months sounds like a long time but when it comes to a taper it is just getting going. I wouldn't go onto another drug, it will just cause more problems, 'cause you'll have the WD from the old drug and the startup from the new drug and your poor old brain will get very confussed and make you feel like s***. Ten months seems a bit long to try a reinstatement, but others are more qualified to talk about that than I am. There are also ways of handing the agoraphobia that others also will talk about. The big thing to remember is that recovery will take time and can't be rushed, but you will get there in the end.

Again welcome.

[Vjune18]

Bilo, I turned on my pm.
brassmonkey:
Yes, I have read around that people just feel worse when they get back onto the same, or a different, pill. What I don't understand is that I felt totally fine for a few months. I was actually quite happy and was feeling myself again. I had absolutely no anxiety. Until one day it just hit me out of nowhere! I was thinking that this whole withdrawal thing was over and I was getting my life back. I am so disappointed that now it is just something new. At least I am not crying all the time and angry and have major headaches like in the beginning. But I didn't think the panic/agoraphobia would come back since it didn't for 8 months post Paxil... I am just so bummed about that.

[Bilo76]

Ok,..pmed you

But i read that a lot on this forum. That people get symptoms after several months. And if you ask me;..its not WD. Its just your original problem returning. If you take meds to deal with agoraphobia and panic then it will just come back after you stop with the meds. Because you havent learned to coop with it but depended on the drugs to deal with it.
But its not like a diabetic that when you stop with the insulin that the problem arrives immediately. It's not that when you stop on wednesday with paxil that on thursday your agoraphobia is back. Agoraphobia is based on so many things. Your thinking pattern, the way you feel, diet perhaps, the way you handle problems etc etc. These patterns take time to put your nerves on edge. So thats why i think it takes time after you stop before the original problem returns

[Vjune18]

Thank you. And I wish someone like my psychiatrist would have told me this as soon as I mentioned that I wanted to come off Paxil, or at least when she put me on it in the first place. If I had known it would be this bad, I probably never would have come off Paxil. I know I need to learn how to deal with it, but how long will this last?! I know no one knows the answer to that question but I also don't want to feel like this will never come to an end...

[Bilo76]

How long the wd last,..no-one can tell. But how long agoraphobia, your original problem, will last:....only you can tell. It will stay with you untill you find a way to deal with it. Listen to the mp3s i send you. Also find a cbt therapist. As you know, being afraid to drive on an open road is an irrational fear. Its not real. So you cant wait till it passes by. It wont leave by itself when its your original problem. Face that fear.
Also paxil doest work for ever

[Bilo76]

How are you holding up vjune?

[IMISSME]

bilo, while I do believe your original symptoms will return I had a very similar pattern to many on here. I was "ok" for 2 months after stopping Paxil. Had read up on the symptoms and only experienced being more sensitive the first 2 months off. Then at 2 months off things symptoms came crashing down like a ton of bricks.

Over the last 12 months I have had them all (except brain zaps oddly enough). I had never had a panic attack in my life. I will just not accept that any of this is part of some sort or "original" condition.

But in the end we all must learn to cope with whatever "this" is. For me the worst are all the irrational fears and doom and gloom thinking.

[Timinjapan]

Paxil can be as good at keeping out anxiety and agoraphobia as an overcoat is for protecting us against cold wind.

Vjune, what is it about big stores that sets off your agoraphobia? I say this because I have a very hard time going into crowded big stores in the suburbs and small towns on weekends, but I'm fine on weekdays when there are less people there and less cars in the parking lot. On the other hand, I am fine being in a crowded department store in a big city. The upscale ambience of a nice department store reassures me, whereas that of a big box supermarket/ home center filled with cheap and tasteless products brings me down. I have felt ambivalent about the latter places for years, but since my "illness", it has developed into a kind of agoraphobia. I feel sick when I am stuck in one of those places.

I echo Bilo's advice to listen to Claire Weekes. Also, read her book "Hope and Help for Your Nerves." Also, her book "Essential Help for Your Nerves" has a lot of info on how to cope with agoraphobia.

And yes, you can definitely be cured, Never doubt that.

[rangerNY]

Agoraphobia is a LEARNED condition. The underlying issue is the anxiety - and the symptoms that come along with it. You fear the symptoms and sensations of anxiety and panic, so you begin to avoid those places and situations that you associate with it. Over time, left unchecked, agoraphobia can progress to the point where some are unable to leave a specific room, or even a specific piece of furniture (I've known people that were terrified to get up off the sofa).

Address the anxiety - and your reaction to it - in a constructive way and the agoraphobia will improve as a result. Take an active role in un-learning these responses. Read everything you can by Claire Weekes, find yourself a good therapist that specializes in CBT with exposure therapy and do the hard work. The strategy for "fixing" your problem is simple - its the execution that's hard because nobody wants to be afraid and uncomfortable. The good news is that once you accept that its the only way out, you'll make pretty good progress.

[Bilo76]

Originally Posted by IMISSME

Over the last 12 months I have had them all (except brain zaps oddly enough). I had never had a panic attack in my life. I will just not accept that any of this is part of some sort or "original" condition.

Thats different m8. You didnt have agoraphobia as a reason to start with paxil. Its only an original condition if you had the same problems before paxil

[Vjune18]

Timinjapan, the amount of people in the departments stores aren't what scare me. Its just the wide opens spaces. There's so much going on and I feel as if I am in a dream and I can't get out. And then I start to wonder is this real? And then when I realize where I am and it is really happening, my heart jsut starts beating faster. Its not just department stores either. I went to a waterpark a few weeks ago and that was just as bad realizing how wide open the place was and all the people just walk around and seem so normal and all I want it to do is stare at the ground and not look up or I will get freaked out. I know I need to get past this though and not let it get any worse =/

rangerNY, thank you for the advice. I sure hope it will not progress to the point where I cannot leave the house. Although I hadn't worked in two weeks and I don't have many friends who can come and pick me up and take me places, I have been home for the most part and haven't gone many places. But it doesn't freak me out to leave the house. I know I can leave the house. Just worried about having a panic attack, or close to it, while driving. That is my main concern.
I have started CBT but I feel like all she is doing is trying to find out what has caused the anxiety and quite frankly, I'm more interested in learning how to deal with this and get past it than I am finding out what caused it. For some reason I keep telling myself that no ONE THING has caused my anxiety. I have had panic attacks since I was in the 5th grade. And I was no where near depressed or stressed at that age. Its just simply spontaeous.

[rangerNY]

VJ -

Trying to find the cause of the anxiety is not really CBT. Press your therapist on that. CBT generally involves specific tasks and exercises designed to challenge the faulty thought patterns that add fuel to the fear cycle. You seem very clear about the specific fear of anxiety while driving. A good CBT practitioner would be addressing that directly by getting you into the car to face that fear directly. If all you're doing in session is talking about how you feel, that's not CBT.

Look at what you wrote about open spaces. Every item involves a reference to "feels like" or "I think". Textbook example of how it's not the place itself that you fear. It's actually your thoughts and reactions that comprise the majority of the "freak out". That's important for you to see because in the end with panic and anxiety disorders (including agoraphobia) what you really have to overcome is inside you. The good news is that everything you need to overcome this is also inside you. You just have to find it and unlock it.

[Timinjapan]

Originally Posted by rangerNY

VJ -...
Look at what you wrote about open spaces. Every item involves a reference to "feels like" or "I think". Textbook example of how it's not the place itself that you fear. It's actually your thoughts and reactions that comprise the majority of the "freak out". That's important for you to see because in the end with panic and anxiety disorders (including agoraphobia) what you really have to overcome is inside you. The good news is that everything you need to overcome this is also inside you. You just have to find it and unlock it.

That's an excellent point. You can think yourself into an anxiety attack but with practice you can also learn to challenge the sort of thinking that takes you there.

[Vjune18]

There are a few things that the therapist has asked me to do on this worksheet such as writing down what it is that I am afraid of..what thinking errors I am using..and a helpful alternative to it. She never really said for me to get in the car and force myself to drive. If anything my boyfriend is the one pushing me to do that. I asked the therapist last week if she wanted me to be driving any more or less or longer distances. She said she wants me to get in the car at least twice a day and just sit and soak it in and find comfort pretty much. I don't know exactly how that is supposed to help me face my fear.. o.O

I never really thought of it in terms of what phrases and words I was using. That actually makes me feel better about it! That its not the actual car that I fear...its my reaction to my thoughts that is so scary. There is nothing to be afraid of inside of the car. The hard part is learning how to put that fear to rest!

I just feel so hopeless..i feel like this process is going to be a long one. Perhaps i'm just looking too far down the road instead of what is right in front of me.

[rangerNY]

Sometimes its just a matter of adjusting expectations. The single most common mistake I see is expecting that you can make the fear go away. Believe it or not, that's not really the goal. The actual goal is to learn to sit in your car (for example) and be afraid without reacting in any way at all. You have to learn to completely and totally accept the fear and relax into it (both your body and mind). That's how you break the fear cycle and gain control and confidence.

Once you learn how to panic without going into a panic, then the fear will start to go away. You actually have to welcome and live with the fear first. Thankfully thats not a very long process once the lightbulb turns on in your head and you decide that its time to accept and face. Only the first few times are terrifying. It gets noticeably easier pretty quickly if you're doing it "right".


Does that make sense?

[Vjune18]

Yes, it makes sense. Your explanations are very clear and I like that. I understand what needs to be done..its the doing it that I haven't been able to overcome. I have actually tried "accepting" the panic feeling. I know what it is, what it feels like, whats going on, and what might follow it. But I haven't yet figured out how to let it sink in without panicking. Therefore I am not doing it "right".

I have to admit your advice has given me reassurance in that I CAN get over this. I'm a very impatient person and I cannot wait for that light bulb to turn on inside my head..I just have to figure out how to turn the switch on!

[rangerNY]

Originally Posted by Vjune18

I'm a very impatient person and I cannot wait for that light bulb to turn on inside my head..I just have to figure out how to turn the switch on!

I can relate. I'm extremely impatient by nature.

Here's the thing. Turn on the light bulb. Today. Right now. The minute you read this message. Its not about waiting for some magical event to happen, its really about just deciding to be courageous. I know, that sounds awful, but courage - doing what you know you need to do even though you're terrified - is probably 85% of the battle in the beginning. I didn't see the movie, but in "We Bought A Zoo", Matt Damon's character said this:

You know, sometimes all you need is twenty seconds of insane courage. Just literally twenty seconds of just embarrassing bravery. And I promise you, something great will come of it.

Understand that you don't have to be insanely brave for the rest of your life, just for the first few days. Believe that it will begin to get easier pretty quickly if you can just get over the first obstacle. Screw in that light bulb and light it up, because it's not going to do it by itself!

[Vjune18]

Wow. I've been needing to hear things like this for a long time. Very direct. I thank God for people like you!
I can't help but to wonder if there is anyone out there who has had the same exact problem as me with driving. I know everyone on this website has suffered or is still suffering from many types of anxiety. But I would like to know that I am not the only one who is SO terrified of driving further than 1 mile.
I still have not had the chance to listen to or read any of Claire Weekes stuff. Perhaps I should try tonight. I was actually planning on trying to drive a further distance today after work. My mother said she would get in the car with me and help prompt me. I am glad I read this now -- it only helps push me to my goal.

[rangerNY]

Originally Posted by Vjune18

I can't help but to wonder if there is anyone out there who has had the same exact problem as me with driving.

Uhm ... you're talking to one. At my worst, getting in the car by myself and driving any more than about a 1/2 mile from the house was a major challenge. That seems like a million years ago now. I'm nothing special. If I can do this, so can you.

Don't take your mother with you in the car. That doesn't actually help anything. YOU have to summon up the courage to do this. You already know that there's really no danger, so its just a matter of really accepting that and floating through the panic. Keep your expectations in line. You're not getting in the car to drive cross country tonight. Do some relaxation breathing before you get in the car. Remind yourself that everything you need to overcome this is inside you. Note your anxiety level on a scale of 1 to 10. Drive away from your house. No need to go far. I don't care if you just drive up and down your street. Just don't go back home until your anxiety level is reduced by 50%. It doesn't have to be zero. Just half of where it was when you started. That might take 10 minutes, or it might take an hour. How long it takes is all up to you. If you fight, squirm, and engage in "Oh my God", it will take much longer. If you want it to be over quickly - relax. Go soft. Focus on your breathing. Slow it down. Let your heart pound. Sweat like a pig if you have to. Let your hands shake and your legs feel like jelly. Doesn't matter. You're still perfectly OK. Trust me on this. If you can just relax into it for a few minutes, that light bulb will pop on. You'll realize that you're going to be OK and that you can do it.

Good luck.

[scotty]

Ryan, my son, had big time driving anxiety, post paxil. He took Drew's advice and now he drives. He'll never "love" driving, but he goes where he needs to go.

[Vjune18]

OH...oops! I'm sorry. I got the impression that you were just extra smart! hehe.

I have tried the relaxation breathing and all is well with controlling my breathing but my heart seems to still be pumping 90 to nothing on the inside no matter how slow I breathe. But it sounds to me like thats ok...? Thank you so much for the advice! I feel like I'm talking to an online CBT therapist! I will try and update tomorrow.

Scotty: Thank you for the reassurance! I'm positive deep down that this will work, I just have to get through the hard part.