Re: Alternative med advice

[Gemma Jane]

Hi everyone,

As many of you know im at rock bottom right now, the intrusive thoughts are driving me crazy. I have just lowered to 20mg as the 30mg was making me worse. I have a physiciatrist on wednesday, does anyone know of any better SSRI or antid or any other medication that will help control my thoughts? Im trying self help but its just not working, I am still cracking up!!! If anyone has any recommendations Id be truly grateful!
I have just started taking Magnesium 300ng and Cod Liver Oil 100mg and Multi Vitamins.

Thank you xx

[Casey1231]

Hi honey,

I am truly sorry that you are having such a struggle right now. I know that when we are in these dark places time seems to slow down to a crawl and we are obsessed with what we should do to make ourselves feel better. I am in a bad state myself right now, in a different way than you, although it is slowly getting better.

This is the reality of your situation. Your brain is adjusting to chemical changes brought on by a strong medication. You are experiencing obsessive thinking which is causing you to fear (1) that you are going to act on a violent impulse, and (2) that this means you are going insane. Neither of these things will happen. Millions of people suffer from some form of obsessive, unwanted thinking. You said (if I remember correctly) that you had these thoughts pre-paxil, but recently they have become constant and unbearable. That is no doubt exacerbated by your dosage change and all the stress you have been under. This is also not a sign of insanity. If anything, you are very sane and acutely aware of your suffering, and the fact that these are disturbing thoughts that are causing you pain. Chances are you are a very kind, good person who is horrified that such ugliness would be in your thinking - again, these thoughts are just results of chemical misfirings and have no relation to the real "you".

I know on a message board you will get different suggestions from different people - I believe it is one of the strengths but also possibly one of the weaknesses, because you can get conflicting suggestions about what is most helpful. So let me say, this is just my opinion based on my own experiences and what I have read. Severe obsessive unwanted thinking usually CAN NOT be stopped by suppression. Trying not to think of the thoughts or trying to stop the thoughts will make them worse. You will find this out when you receive "Imp of the Mind" (which you have already ordered and it is on its way.) The author of that book runs a renowned clinic in the USA which treats just this problem, they have worked with many thousands of people and their treatment advice is not thought stopping. It is to allow the thoughts to be there, to recognize they are just thoughts and you will not act on them. It may even be helpful to write all the bad thoughts down, just let them out on paper and see them for what they are.

I think this problem is not discussed as much as panic attacks or depression because people are truly ashamed that such a thought could even enter their mind, deep down they think it must be a reflection of their true character or something they must really want to do . THIS IS FALSE. Frequently the thoughts include fears they will act out in ways that are violent, racist, sexually abusive, pedophilia, etc. It seems the darker and more disturbing the thought, the harder it is to remove. Almost always, these patients are not convicted pedophiles, criminals, etc. - in fact they are usually kind, sensitive people who have a highly developed conscience and tend to be very hard on themselves. Does this sound familiar? You are not a bad person, you are a person suffering from a common ailment that is in crisis right now due to chemical misfirings. If possible, try to go for a walk, a bike ride, a swim, etc. When the thought comes say, "hello thought" and keep on doing whatever you were doing. See your thoughts as little harmless gnats that just want to annoy you, they have no power. You may also try meditating, doing slow deep breathing and "watching" your thoughts as they come and go, having no power over you.

I usually try not to get so advice-giving because I am not your doctor, but I can really see you are suffering badly the last several days and I believe in my heart this advice will help you. If not, feel free to discard it. I hope that you will find some peace soon.

[Gemma Jane]

Casey you have been such a support to me these last few days and I feel terrible that I did not realise you were also suffering yourself. If you need any advice I would love to be able to try to offer some advice x

Thank you. Yes, I am a very gentle natured person and id like to say have a good heart. The thoughts are giving me headaches. My mind is just so overactive 24/7 right now. I really want to get better and get on with my work and my studying more than anything and just to be happy.

I just feel utterly hopeless. I have to go out shortly and will have to drive, when im driving I have the thoughts also. I really dont want to have to go into a hospital but maybe its where I should be?

Do you think I will start to stabilise back on the 20mg soon.

Also, not sure I mentioned this previously, I had started to feel better on the 20mg before my 30mg increase and around the same time I caught a sickness bug, I was sick for about a week so maybe my meds werent getting any benefit, is this possible?

The book still hasnt arrived, I have a confirmation email so I will chase it up! Im going to pop into the local library also today and see if they have any information until then.

Im supposed to be going to a party tonight, I will not be drinking, but im very nervous about going.

[Casey1231]

You are sweet, I am doing better day by day. I also got a stomache bug, which I didn't realize at first, thinking it was all paxil - then my son started vomiting continuously for 2 days, so I realized it was largely that. I also had recently dropped my dose, had PMS, etc., so I was just thrown into chaos and a week of pretty bad anxiety and depression. As always, the good folks here have helped me out and I am feeling better with each passing day (although my stomache is still funky.) I feel worse in the morning, then as the day passes it eases.

Regarding the hospital - it sounds like you are doing OK at the moment. I believe there is no shame going to a hospital if you need to, but at this point I think they would probably not be able to do much more for you except give you some more drugs. If you truly feel unsafe or you might harm yourself, then perhaps you should go, otherwise, just treat yourself with lots of love and self-care. You may want to rethink the party tonight. Once you're there, the temptation to self-medicate with alcohol may be overwhelming (I should know I am a recovering alcoholic, thank God I have been sober for many years.) And adding alcohol to this mix would be a recipe for disaster right now. If you feel you going to the party would be a good distraction for you and you are confident you could stay away from the alcohol, then maybe you should go, but bring a friend who knows what you are going through and keep her close.

Maybe a better idea would be to rest, rent some funny videos, pamper yourself like you would a sick child.

Helping you across the Atlantic is making me feel better here, thats the way it works. Someday you will be an enormous source of strength and inspiration to another suffering soul, because this will have passed and you will have learned a little more about yourself in the process.

Be well.

[LCrawford67]

Casey, what beautiful advice you've given! And, although I'm sorry you have a stomach bug (it's going around here too) I'm glad it's not the Paxil. That has to be a relief to you.

Gemma, I wouldn't advise any med for you at this point. You need to get stable on 20 mgs first. You would also need to taper from Paxil, before even thinking about another med.

Again, Casey's given you wonderful advice. Pamper yourself, you'll get stable soon, but in the meantime, keep things light hearted, don't let the intrusive thoughts worry you. They're only thoughts. Going to a fun party may be just what you need! But, absolutely NO DRINKING!

[Casey1231]

Thanks Laurie - I did indeed have a stomache bug, however, I think the paxil was playing a big part. I have had several mornings of anxiety and restlessness that were bordering on the unbearable for hours on end, and I know just a stomach bug wouldn't do that. It was kind of like a "perfect storm" of paxil, stomache bug, hormones, life stress, etc. It also really tapped into some deep-seated fears I have about medication, inadequacy, fear of a nervous breakdown, old memories, etc. It's been a trying week (I am away from home too!) but I am definitely learning and growing a lot.

Gemma, I think if you go into the search archives and type in "unwanted thoughts", "disturbing intrusive thoughts", etc., you will see you are not alone and others have gone through this same thing and come out okay, this may also bring you some comfort.

[Gemma Jane]

Thank you both so much.

Is it possible the stomach upset I had could have stopped my meds working properly?

I really really dotn want to go into a hospital, I dont feel as tearful as I did nor so suicidial, its the thoughts that are upsetting me more than anything. Im just so scared I would do something!!

[LCrawford67]

Stomach upset more than likely caused you more anxiety.

You're saying you don't feel as bad as you did, so let's focus on that. It's ok that the thoughts were upsetting, but they're only thoughts. Nothing more. Again, focus on the small victories, like you not feeling as sad or suicidal, and build from there. The rest will fall into place.

[Gemma Jane]

Thanks Laurie. The thoughts are really upsetting me though as they are there almost every waking moment, will they ever go? Im trying really hard to accept them and then tell them to go away in my head but to no avail. :-(
Im just so scared they will never ever go!

[LCrawford67]

Oh, they'll go, believe me. But, when we first get a symptom, like this one, we obsess on it. It's very foreign and scary. Eventually though, it will subside.

[altostrata]

You may want to take fish oil instead of cod liver oil. Fish oil has the ingredient EPA in it. This is what is good to support mood. See http://paxilprogress.org/forums/showthread.php?t=14397

Gemma, is it possible for you to get liquid Seroxat? It could be that a dose of 21mg or 22mg won't give you such severe withdrawal symptoms. You may need to taper by perhaps 1mg at a time. 10mg is a big drop.

[TryingtoGetWell]

Alto, you might have missed the previous thread where Laurie (Scotty) and Rita, I believe, advised Gemma Jane to drop back to 20 because she had just gone up to 30 about a week or so before and had gotten worse after doing so. They believe she is having an adverse reaction to the drug and that the recent increase made things worse rather than better, which is why they suggested she drop back to the previous 20 right away. I believe she just did that a couple of days ago and is already seeming to have a bit of improvement.

The previous thread is http://www.paxilprogress.org/forums/...t=30309&page=2

Good point about the fish oil and EPA; I had forgotten about that.

[TryingtoGetWell]

Gemma Jane, I just noticed in that earlier thread that you just started taking multi-vitamins as well as magnesium and cod liver oil.

I agree with altostrata that you'd probably be much better off with a good quality fish oil instead of the cod liver oil.

But I'd hold off on the mult-vitamin right now. Multi-vitamins contain B vitamins, and B vitamins have a stimulant quality in withdrawal which has worsened withdrawal symptoms in some of us. You might want to hold off on the mult-vitamins until you're feeling better, then try them gradually. But certainly try the magnesium and fish oil now, they might really help you.