lost all my humanity (thanks Bupropion/Wellbutrin)

[audrealjade]

Originally Posted by DeVoid

All the tests were from my PCP (it was a single blood and urine test covering a wide range of bases). I am still not convinced my thyroid wasn't an issue. As I said, after I began taking these dessicated thyroid supplements a lot of my symptoms had abated.

It's possible that they are actually restoring my thyroid levels to normal and that this neuropathy is a completely separate issue. I really want to see the numbers for myself, since what is "normal" for thyroid hormone levels (especially TSH) is a very wide range that may not be the same for everyone.

If these OTC pills are working for me, that is fine with me, and I will take them every day for life if necessary. There is a part of me that isn't sure they are actually doing anything, so I will probably go off them at some point just to see if I notice any changes (I wouldn't want to be spending money on them for nothing).

There are independent testing labs you can go to for a more complete thyroid workup, and I may consider doing that at some point, as TSH alone isn't the be-all-end-all thyroid test like mainstream medicine would lead you to believe.

Absolutely! Go to stopthethyroidmadness.com and there is a great wealth of information about lab testing and mistakes doctors make. Usually they recommend going to a holistic practitioner because they can read the results better.

[kassj0peja]

hello, i am 31 and come from austria. so my english is very good but not perfect. especially in terms of medical words.

i realized that i lost my soul, humanity, or however you call it 8 days ago.

besides my emotions i lost

my libido, my taste or the ability to enjoy food/drinks, sense of pain, the feeling of being hungry or full and the feeling of being tired (i think the latter is gone now).

at the beginning i had a rational feeling of being shocked when i realized that i lost emotions. now there is only some kind of rational hope to get it back and the despair that i have to "live my whole life" as a zombie.

i still have a rational motivation to do things. so i can tell you my whole story if you are "interested" in it.

but before doing this i want to know if there are cases that prove that people got their souls back.

btw. yesterday i could laugh out loud and had the emotion of anger. so before i went to bed humanity was back. and it felt really good. i could sleep well too for the first time. after getting up this happiness was still there. after having a nap i was like a zombie again. but i believe it can disappear.

[DeVoid]

Originally Posted by kassj0peja

hello, i am 31 and come from austria. so my english is very good but not perfect. especially in terms of medical words.

i realized that i lost my soul, humanity, or however you call it 8 days ago.

besides my emotions i lost

my libido, my taste or the ability to enjoy food/drinks, sense of pain, the feeling of being hungry or full and the feeling of being tired (i think the latter is gone now).

at the beginning i had a rational feeling of being shocked when i realized that i lost emotions. now there is only some kind of rational hope to get it back and the despair that i have to "live my whole life" as a zombie.

i still have a rational motivation to do things. so i can tell you my whole story if you are "interested" in it.

but before doing this i want to know if there are cases that prove that people got their souls back.

btw. yesterday i could laugh out loud and had the emotion of anger. so before i went to bed humanity was back. and it felt really good. i could sleep well too for the first time. after getting up this happiness was still there. after having a nap i was like a zombie again. but i believe it can disappear.

I'm glad you found my thread. Can you tell me how you got into this state (what medication you took and how long you were on it)? Did it happen suddenly?

I don't know if you read the most recent posts in this thread, but I AM PROOF that people get their "souls" back. For me, it took nearly two years, but I am finally starting to regain myself and come back to the person I used to be. I spent over a year in bed (literally). If I can improve, I think anyone can.

No matter what, please never give up hope. It may take time, but in the end, if you wait long enough, everything changes. I've seen it happen again and again in my life. This latest test was the most difficult of my life, but something happened that I never thought would.... it changed. Nothing is permanent.

Please hang in there, and know there is a whole community of (mostly) supportive people that will be here for you. Even if you don't feel like you relate to anyone (which I didn't), just post what you are feeling. Fill up pages and pages if you want (like I did), just get it out and express what it is like to experience what you are going through.

If you want to PM me and we can talk privately.

[DeVoid]

BTW, I had further blood testing and it revealed that I am "very low" in vitamin D. Not being exposed to the sun for a year and a half is probably a big factor. I was prescribed a synthetic D2 drug, however I am likely going to go with an over the counter D3 supplement as D3 is absorbed better by the body, and it is cheaper for me.

[kassj0peja]

thanks for your answer. there is no need to talk to you privatley. if there are other people out there experiencing this, they should have access to it.

i have never taken drugs or any kind of medicine. so the reason for me must be a different one.

until the age of 26 i had an average western life. job, disatisfaction, occasional sadness, better times and then i had a depression. i always analyzed my emotions and i was still able to to things. so i organized a world trip. i felt much better during this trip. the people in cambodia showed me how stupid i was. they dont have all this social pressure to be & look better, earn more money, have the bigger house or car and so on. so those people almost only had needs like a caveman. and the pressure to have enough food tomorrow. just like cavemen. they just completely changed my worldview.
after that i went back to southeastasia to work as a diveguide (my passion) on a small island in burma. there i had an accident and i was floating 8 hours on the ocean. this neardeath experience changed my attitudes even stronger. after that i worked in chile and spent a few months in argentina and colombia. after that i did a pacific crossing on a small sailing boat. we had big technical problems in the middle of the ocean and at some point i thought we will not make it. so another neardeath experience that changed my values and how i should live my life. because i reached the lower financial limit i flew back to austria in august 2011.

here i am working as a receptionist in a noble gym. most of the customers are unhappy, complaining people. it can be a very stressful job and right next to gym there is the entrance for a kids park and it is sooooo noisy. until now i was working for 5 and half months without a single day of vacation. because it can happen that a lot of customers are waiting for something at the same time and start to become impatient i became kind of humanmass phobic. so a metro packed with people was very uncomfortable for me in the last few weeks. it is also very unnatural to say hello and goodbye a few hundred times, sometimes in one sentence. and when i have a conversation with somebody i like other customers always interrupt us and that drives me crazy (the anger i felt yesterday was caused by this). in the last few weeks i also had a problem with a girl i started to like. additionally somebody stole money from the safe (3 times). one time it happened during my shift. so that was stressful too. because my job was quite enjoyable the first few months and the other things happened within a short period i think my brain wants to show me that i need to make a drastic change.

i was working until 11pm yesterday and at 10pm i started to have weak emotions again. these emotions lasted until 1pm today. today at 4 pm i started to work and i am feeling more like a robot than a zombie right now. so i guess my brain is in protection mode again. tomorrow i have to work again and then i have 7 days off. i informed the company already that i am going to quit by the end of may. so i have approximately 15 working days left.

edit: the vitamin d thing sounds interesting. i didnt get much sun in the last few weeks.

[kassj0peja]

i was observing the changes in the last 3 days. everytime shortly before the end of my shift i got something back (happiness, taste/the ability to enjoy food). a few hours before i had to go to work everthing disappeared again. only the ability to feel tired was there. but last night i did not go to bed when i felt tired. so maybe everyhting disappeard again because i was too exhausted.

i believe that in my case it is a combination of the stress that my job causes and the lack of vitamin d. so i think whenever the small of amount of vitamin d that my body produces is gone i am back to nothingness. because i know now that it is possible to get something back (at least temporarily) the nothingness is a differnt one. it is more hopeful and not desparate or shocking like it was when i noticed the first time that i dont have emotions.

so today i am going to buy vitamin d tablets, keep me busy and stay outside (even though it is cloudy). i also have the impression that people that i once liked/loved are sort of healing me too.

i have another theory. since i dont feel physical pain i can imagine that the reason can be my spine too. that is the only part of my body where i feel pain, and it is a permanent one. i was talking to physiotherapist that was healed and taught in a chinese buddhist temple (he has a very good reputation) and he said he had a client with the same symptoms. and the problems were caused by the spine.

@devoid: because i did not have much time in the last few days so i was not even able to thank you properly for you kind words. i and you know too, that they dont mean that much to me at the moment. but still, thank you vrry much.

[TryingtoGetWell]

Originally Posted by kassj0peja

...

i have never taken drugs or any kind of medicine. so the reason for me must be a different one...

edit: the vitamin d thing sounds interesting. i didnt get much sun in the last few weeks.

Welcome kass0peja.

If you've never taken medications, the cause it's medication withdrawal which is what this site deals with and which too often causes symptoms like this.

But other things than withdrawal and vitamin D deficiency can cause the kind of symptoms you're having.

I really suggest you get a checkup at your doctor to find out if there is any physical basis for the problems. Your doctor can order a blood test for vitamin D level at the same time.

You should get the test for vitamin D level before you take a vitamin D supplement. A few weeks without sunlight would not cause a vitamin D deficiency - that would take much longer to develop. But it's certainly worth having it checked by your doctor, as long as the doctor checks for other things as well.

[TryingtoGetWell]

Originally Posted by DeVoid

BTW, I had further blood testing and it revealed that I am "very low" in vitamin D. Not being exposed to the sun for a year and a half is probably a big factor. I was prescribed a synthetic D2 drug, however I am likely going to go with an over the counter D3 supplement as D3 is absorbed better by the body, and it is cheaper for me.

I'm so glad you're getting better DeVoid! Great news!

Glad you found out about the low D level. I take vitamin D and probably always will have to (can't be in sun due to skin condition - but also have an auto-immune disease that prevents the body from properly utilizing vitamin D, so I have to take quite a bit to keep my levels where they should be!). My doctor said to definitely use a good-quality d3 - not D2.

[miriza]

Devoid, how have you been doing? I hope you are still improving!!!!

[Bilo76]

Jeez what a story Devoid. Reading it for the first time. Read every letter. i have some personal ideas about your past and symptoms but will keep them to myself. But i feel for you and i must admit i am a bit anxious after reading your horror story since i have DP/DR very badly.
I am very happy that things improved for you. I am curious how you are doing now. Keep us informed please.
And i am wondering if you are "back to normal" how you gonna handle your original depression problem.

[DeVoid]

Originally Posted by miriza

Devoid, how have you been doing? I hope you are still improving!!!!

Hi, thanks for asking. I'm honestly happy with where I am right now mentally and emotionally. My mind is clear, and I feel like my personality is pretty much back to normal. I'm able to feel things normally and I have my interests and feeling of being alive and human back.

I try not to compare this version of myself with the one before all of this went down (there's always a sense that the past was better and that I'm not as good as I used to be, but I am trying to live in the current moment).

I started a low carb diet at the beginning of July and continued with the exercise. I've lost around 10 pounds so far. I'm finding the weight loss is really slow going this time (I've lost 130 pounds before) but that may be because I'm older and my metabolism has slowed.

The physical symptoms that began in January have mostly gone away, however there are a couple of new ones. I've been getting numbness and tingling. The tingling happens is in my hands and arms, and it feels like they are about to fall asleep or just a weird sensation (kind of like restless leg syndrome but in the arms).

The most recent thing is a mild numbness on the left side of my face and left arm (and sometimes it also happens on the left side of my stomach and left leg/thigh). It's a superficial thing that comes and goes and doesn't affect my muscle strength at all.

I've been to a neurologist this past Tuesday and she did a general neurological test (which was fine) and ordered a blood test. I also had a brain MRI on Friday. She said it was to rule out MS. If the tests come back negative the cause is going to be "idiopathic" (i.e. unknown).

I kind of doubt that these could still be withdrawal symptoms from the Wellbutrin, as I haven't taken a pill in 2 years and 3 months. Is this unheard of, to have new withdrawal symptoms this long after stopping? I'm hoping the tests come back negative. Wish me luck.

[DeVoid]

Originally Posted by Bilo76

Jeez what a story Devoid. Reading it for the first time. Read every letter. i have some personal ideas about your past and symptoms but will keep them to myself. But i feel for you and i must admit i am a bit anxious after reading your horror story since i have DP/DR very badly.
I am very happy that things improved for you. I am curious how you are doing now. Keep us informed please.
And i am wondering if you are "back to normal" how you gonna handle your original depression problem.

If you'd like to PM me, I'm interested in hearing your thoughts. I don't want my last message to imply that everything in my life is rosy. I've got lots of issues that need addressing, however, I am pretty much in a holding pattern.

I honestly don't have the motivation to do much, though I know I need to start building a life for myself. I'll be 34 this month, I really don't want to still be here at 40 in the same house I was born in, on disability.

I still have very low self-esteem and I'm not quite sure what the next move should be in my life. I've only got an associates degree, and I'm not sure if I have the skill or motivation to use the skills I acquired (computer programming).

To be 34 and not have a job history doesn't help (I've quit every job I've had prematurely because of the depression). I really have a lot of uncertainty about my future, but I guess the fact that I'm able to care about it now is
a good sign.

I just hope I am able to take the steps necessary to move on with my life, even if it's taking a menial job at first. I definitely need money, and my own car (which I don't have). The fact that the economy is still hurting doesn't help. I don't even know if I'd be able to get a job.

Anyway, before anything I'd like to lose enough weight to feel comfortable with myself, but it's slow going. Wish me luck.

[DeVoid]

BTW, I started an Instagram channel in case anyone wants to check it out. I am awed by nature and fascinated by it. I never fancied myself as a photographer, but with the filters Instagram can make dull things look interesting. Most of these were taken at one park I like to go to not far from me. LMK what you think.

http://web.stagram.com/n/privatev0id/

[miriza]

I am SOOOOOO happy for you Devoid! This gives us all so much hope, especially since you were doing bad for so long. I am so glad you are getting your life back.

Those remaining physical symptoms are not unheard of after 2-3 years of withdrawal, but like you're doing it is always good to have it checked out.

Sooo glad for you!!! Will check your pictures in a minute.

Hugs,
--miriza

[miriza]

Originally Posted by DeVoid

If you'd like to PM me, I'm interested in hearing your thoughts. I don't want my last message to imply that everything in my life is rosy. I've got lots of issues that need addressing, however, I am pretty much in a holding pattern.

I honestly don't have the motivation to do much, though I know I need to start building a life for myself. I'll be 34 this month, I really don't want to still be here at 40 in the same house I was born in, on disability.

I still have very low self-esteem and I'm not quite sure what the next move should be in my life. I've only got an associates degree, and I'm not sure if I have the skill or motivation to use the skills I acquired (computer programming).

To be 34 and not have a job history doesn't help (I've quit every job I've had prematurely because of the depression). I really have a lot of uncertainty about my future, but I guess the fact that I'm able to care about it now is
a good sign.

I just hope I am able to take the steps necessary to move on with my life, even if it's taking a menial job at first. I definitely need money, and my own car (which I don't have). The fact that the economy is still hurting doesn't help. I don't even know if I'd be able to get a job.

Anyway, before anything I'd like to lose enough weight to feel comfortable with myself, but it's slow going. Wish me luck.

As long as you're doing better mentally and emotionally, things will fall into place. It is just a matter of time. 34 sounds like a lot (I'm 35 btw), but it's probably not even half of your lifetime. You have a future ahead of you. Just overcoming this horrible experience is a major accomplishment. There's nothing harder than this and you are overcoming it.

[miriza]

Originally Posted by DeVoid

BTW, I started an Instagram channel in case anyone wants to check it out. I am awed by nature and fascinated by it. I never fancied myself as a photographer, but with the filters Instagram can make dull things look interesting. Most of these were taken at one park I like to go to not far from me. LMK what you think.

http://web.stagram.com/n/privatev0id/

My favorite is "Confusion", the stone wall. Very nice. I love pictures with a lot of texture. I also like the one of the trees.

My husband is into photography too and I was a little bit before this mess. Can't wait to get back to it.

So glad you're getting out into nature after being at home for so long. I rarely leave the house too (maybe once or twice a week at the most).

[MrAnhedonic]

Devoid... I'm experiencing anhedonia. I'm 19 years old, and SSRI antidepressants (Prozac) has destroyed my life. I have not felt emotions ever since... I always wondered why the excitement/joy from life was gone... then I found out why... and well, it was beyond heart breaking... to know something like this happened to me.

Like you, I feel dead... and almost don't even care about it. I feel like I can just lay in bed for the next 60 years and die.. and practically accepted that my life is over. I only took it for 6 months!!!

Do you think there's anything I can do? Or should I just simply wait?

p.s. do you think thyroid medications made you regain your emotions? just curious...

[TheBobbi]

Hi Devoid, I've been in this state from 2 years now. I know how bad it is and can relate to you fully. I noticed that I can't experiance anxiety as well, any anxiety. I can cry a little bit but that's pretty much it. It's great that your recovering from this.
Could you tell me what kind of thryroid and adrenal suppliments helped you recover. I would want to try them myself.

[blossomandaut]

Devoid,
You are a complete and utter STAR!!! How you coped for so long in that state is testiment to the incredible person that you are. I am in awe.
You deserve the rest of your life to be filled with happiness and health.
I do think the numbness and tingling is due to the drugs and that it too will disappear. I tingle and vibrate all the time!!!
You have no idea how happy and postive your posts have made me. I nearly stopped reading your initial posts as they were so depressing and I was worried your life was over.
Good luck in regaining the rest of your life.
Lu x

[flor]

Hello Devoid.

I just read through this whole thread for about the last 2 hours.

Your journey is a spiritual journey.
This is called by the mistics "The Dark Night of the Soul". Where there is nothing, not even your soul, not even god. It is a godless emptyness. When I was 22 I went through this experience in one day, caused by ingestion of psychotropic mushrooms in Mexico. It was the deepest most life changing experience in my life. For some hours, everything that was known to me, outside of myself and inside of my self, became meaningless. I was peeling like an onion and in the core there was nothing. At first there was terror. But in the end there was nobody there to be terrorized. I did not love anyone, I was nothing. There was no meaning and no desire. There still was a mind thinking, but no soul related to that thinking.
I remember thinking to myself that if this state persisted beyod the mushroom "effects", then I would kill myself but soon I realized that even to kill yourself you need to have a desire not to live anymore, or somenthing. There is still somebody there to kill. That was not my case, it was the cosmic emptyness. This lasted for a couple of hours. I was just sitting there. I could speak, etc. but...what for?

Then something amazing happened. When there was no longer a "me" there, a "person", someting else came up into conciousness which wasnt "me", or related to "me". It existed completely on its own, completely independent of the circunstantial "mes", or "persons", or "identities". It was something alive that was behind all the apparent forms that in themselves were empty (this including the former "me"). This presence, this existence, indistructible, was completely independent from cicumstances. It was so overwhelming, and parallel to this the state of "not being" of my "person", persisted, but I reallized that precisely because all the "person", the "soul" in "me" had died, this pervading presence was being able to be perceived. This presence, I knew, was the fountain of all life, it wass Life itself, complete in its perfection, power, REAL, independent completely of the APPARENT AND CIRCUMSTANTIAL FORMS which had been "me". "I" was still empty, but there was an infinite joy. The joy was not me. The joy was completely independent from me. I knew then that if I died right then, it would not matter at all. Even if I forgot right then everything. It wouldnt matter at all, because that fountain of life cannot be distructed or threatened by anything. And I realized also that the ONLY way of becaming concious of this Life, is dying, but not in your body. Soul dying. We are attached to the soul, the person. Only when the person is no longer there, when it realized its fundamental emptyness, can this Life be seen through.
This state had an ending in chronological time, but did not end in the dimension outside time. It was not an "effect of the mushroom", as what happened to you is not an "effect of drugs" although they may have triggered it.
Yo went through derealization. It is the hardest spiritual test.
You should have spiritual support. After my experience I read tons of literature of the mistics. I very very much recommend to you spiritual readings and excercises. Read Eckhart Tolle, an elightened person of our time. Read "The perennial philosophy" by Aldous Huxley. Read "The chamanic experience", by various authors. Read "A course in miracles", a book full of invaluable tips for the most difficult stages in the spiritual journey. Read Simone Weil (Gravity and Grace, Awaiting god). Read iluminated poetry (Rumi, "The four quartets" by TS Elliot, Rainer Maria Rilke).
Listen to Eckart Tolle videos in the net, the fountain of life shines through him. Do yoga. Do some energy healing, "The Reconnection" is a very good technich, you can google it and find a practitioner close to your home. Even Reiki, but the Reconnection is more powerful (its name says it all).

and HAVE A DOG!!!!!!! Their non human energy is so good to have around, as they are always connected to the fountain of life, and you can connect to it through them.

Your experience can just end there, or it can be "used" as the most powerful spiritual experience there is. All this things will help you in the last stage of your journey, only after erasure, the Real thing can appear.

hugs, Flor

[flor]

Devoid!!!!!
I have seen your photos. They are wonderful. There is the Presence shining through them, no doubt!!!!!

like in TS Elioit and Rumi poems, like in van goghs and vouillard's paintings.

Another good book which combines the spiritual with the scientific perspective: "Migraine" by the psichiatrist and neurologist Oliver Sacks, about the relationship between spiritual experience, migraine and epilepsy.

Get "The Power of Now" by Eckart Tolle. And watch his videos.

And if you love nature (and the Presence that shines through it more clearly than throug anything else), you willo LOVE this movie:
MICROCOSMOS, in 6 parts, HD:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHCAzcwzq5o

hugs.

[ladyshep]

Man this stuff is poison. I hope you get better soon and so sorry to hear about your troubles.

[ladyshep]

but glad that you are getting better. It just pains me the things people have to go through. But hopefully you can help someone!! It is terrible that poison is out on the market and people have to go through the things that you and others have gone through.