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General Discussion Open discussion about Paxil, Paxil Withdrawal, successes and progress, good stories and bad, with and without.

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Old 08-24-2004, 11:36 AM   #1
dar7726
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Response to ?/Dr. Tracy/ inability to metabolize serotonin

For those who might miss this on the Dr. Tracy Thread...


I sent Dr. Tracy several emails. This one she has answered....

My Email first quoted Dr. Tracy in an interview and then I asked my question:

According to Tracy, "There's a lot of science to demonstrate that depression is the result of an inability to metabolize serotonin, but somehow the drug companies have got the world believing that an increase in serotonin, rather than an increase in serotonin metabolism, is what the depressed person needs."

Dr. Tracy, then how does a person increase the metabolism of serotonin. I've been trying to research to discover this, but can not find the information.

Please help.....
Darlene

Her reply to my email is as follows:

I discuss them in my book and tape. The only things I have found that do this are natural. One is sunshine, garlic, negative ions, exercise, and anything that will help the pineal gland to function better like frankensence oil or brain power oil . . . and I wonder about digestive enzymes. We are still looking for ways to accomplish that. That is why chemically increasing levels is so terrible . . . we know so little about increasing it.

Dr. Tracy
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:15 PM   #2
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Hi Dar,

I've gotten a few replies from Dr Tracy also. I will post if you wanna read.


Tom
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Old 08-24-2004, 04:08 PM   #3
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I'd Love it Tommy. Please do. I sent her two others, but this is the only one she replied to.


Thanks,
Darlene
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Old 08-25-2004, 06:36 AM   #4
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Hi Dar,

Here's the first:


If I were you I would DEFINATELY contact the Baum Hedlund law firm to file suit for the withdrawal from Paxil.

The symptoms, as I mention on my tape, go on for much longer when you go off abruptly rather than slowly. Most of them are centered around problems with low blood sugar though. This is why watching the blood sugar is so important after using SSRIs.

The withdrawal Reliv can produce is brought on through detox. It is normal for the body to do everything it can to get those drugs out of your system. They are foreign substances. In order to save your life the body will do all in its power to help you to rid itself of those drugs. As the body gains more energy and health it will work to get rid of the drugs. I found that when I got into health years ago after surgery. I felt many of the drugs coming out of my system. There should be no withdrawal associated with stopping Reliv - no more than stopping eating would produce withdrawal. It is food.

Take care of yourself and keep getting better. I love to see patients beat the effects of the drugs so that the drug company does not "win" in the end. They did not get you as a permanent patient, which I firmly believe is their goal with these drugs.

Dr. Tracy

In a message dated 6/30/2004 3:30:11 PM Mountain Daylight Time, troll123.1@netzero.com writes:




*I guess that leads to my question: How long does this "cycling"
typically last? NEVER prior to taking SSRI's did I have anxiety, depression or the strange thinking (described to the tee in your book).

*Also, I am interested in Reliv but aprehensive due tothe "aggravation" of withdrawl syptoms it can cause. How severe is this aggrivation and why does it happen? After using Reliv for an extended period, can there be any withdrawal associated with not taking it for periods at a time?

I still entertain taking legal action against GSK but am not sure what it entails. I am married and have 3 young children and a busy job that come first, but I think someone should be held accountable for this terrible type of neglegence!

If you are able to respond to my message I would like to thank you immensely for the time.

Tom D
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:04 AM   #5
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and another...


I have heard of Rob, but know little about him. This has all mushroomed so fast lately after I spent years nearly singlehandedly trying to get someone to listen, that I cannot begin to keep up with all of the sites that have sprung up and people now fighting the battle. I don't know where I got the idea that everyone would join us to do this so that we would have a unified front against them . . . but for some ODD reason so many have the idea that these drugs are different, rather than just clones.

As for the anesthesia you are right. It could be absolutely deadly. I have seen horrific results and even death. I did just find out more about a product I have been looking for for the past few years though. One woman healed a herniated disc using it. All it is is a combination of greens in a powdered form that you make into a drink. I will follow up on that and see if I can get more details about it.

Dr. Tracy

In a message dated 7/2/2004 7:37:17 AM Mountain Daylight Time, troll123.1@netzero.com writes:



Subj: Re: Tom Blake asked me to email you
Date: 7/2/2004 7:37:17 AM Mountain Daylight Time




Hi Dr Tracy,

Thanks a million for the response. I am going to investigate taking action. This whole ordeal was a lot worse than I described. I don't know if you know who Rob Robinson is (Prisoner of Paxil and ssricitizen websites) but my case was quite similar to his. I was in disbelief at our similar reactions when I found his site and read his journal.

I agree on the blood sugar statement. Even to the day, if I'm feeling a little "off", eating a good meal seems to curb anxiety. I can't stress how annoying this is as I was NEVER anxious before this. The whole thing stinks!

I hate to be a pest but I have one more question. My lower back has 2 herniated discs and docs wanna do surgery to fix. I am very worried about the effects of the anesthesia and having had the bad reaction to paxil (after reading your book). Daily activity is painful, but not debilitating. Am I a candidate for having a bad reaction with the anesthedia?

Once again, thank you for the time.

Tom D
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:34 AM   #6
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Tommy,

Did you tell her your whole story.... I'd like to but it is very long. Everyone keeps telling me I should write my story. Anyway... I'd also like to know what green product that she tells you to take.

And I'd also like to say for others.... If you contact Dr. Tracy and she responds to you... It might be helpful to post it here and keep this thread going.

I know she does not know the answers to everything regarding withdrawal but it would be interesting just to see her responses here.


Darlene
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:38 AM   #7
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Here's another one..... I have to say the joint/muscle pain has been worse since I've started the rebounding... But I was also out of Co Q 10. Anyway here's the email.... I also wish she had given a more detailed response. But hey, she did respond.....



The oils are a great help and Diane is wonderful about helping with those. Her number is in the book and on the tape - 303-766-9760. I use the Panaway on my whiplash I just got and used in on a crushed skull in a little puppy a few weeks ago - it was a miracle!!!!

Hyperbaric oxygen really helps too. The reason for all the pain is that the drugs screw up the ability to metabolize calcium they way you should. Good sources of calcium that are easy to digest would really help. And digestive enzymes probably would as well.

I need to do a book on withdrawal and how to recover I guess.

Dr. Tracy

In a message dated 8/24/2004 5:07:38 PM Mountain Daylight Time, DAR7726@aol.com writes:


Subj: Does detoxing or exercise throw the toxins back into your body or blood stream
Date: 8/24/2004 5:07:38 PM Mountain Daylight Time
From: DAR7726@aol.com
To: drugawareness-owner@yahoogroups.com
Sent from the Internet



Dr. Tracy, I'm sorry to be a bother. I have so many questions and there is just no one to ask who is an expert. I do have your CD's but it does not address these issues. I'm a frequent poster on the http://www.paxilprogress.org/ site and there are lots of questions as to what to do to help us during withdrawal. Some folks have done liver, gallbladder and colonex and ended up worse. Others say exercise makes them worse.

I. for one have been off these drugs only 4 months. The muscle, joint pain and insomnia is the worse. It seems to have gotten worse in just the last few days with adding the rebounder/exercises. The rebounder is good for your adrenals I hear which are shot from taking these drugs. Its so hard to know what to do. Detox or not, exercise or not. And I guess I should really get the oils.

Any other suggestions, if you have the time. I know you are a very busy woman.

Darlene
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:49 AM   #8
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Hi Dar,

Yes, I did tell her my whole story (short form). I would if I were you. I think the reason I feel so compelled to tell it is because I had no issues with anxiety or depression prior to taking Paxil. I do not have depression now, but about 6 months after I quit cold turkey, I did have it. For no reason at all. It just hit me. Then bouts with anxiety hung around until lately; they've been steadily decreasing. My point: Paxil DOES (if I could scream this I would) cause abnormal thinking, anxiety, depression, and the scores of other symptoms described on this site.

Too bad we couldn't band together and hire Dr Tracy to speak at a convention. I wonder if she does that sort of thing???

Tom
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:54 AM   #9
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Tommyd,

Why were you put on AD's.... Just curious since you did not have, depression or anxiety...


Darlene
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Old 08-25-2004, 08:50 AM   #10
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Ha ha, good question.

I kept getting an intermitten "dizziness" for no reason at all. I woke up with it one day about 6 years ago. Couldn't relate it to any cause.

At first I lived with it, then I started a new job and had bigger obligations which forced me to seek a cause for it. Previous docs told me it was drainage (for 2 years straight???) then family doc said stress, try Celexa. I said "I don't feel anxious or stressed, just feel disequilibirum". He said try Celexa, it will calm you down. Not knowing anything about ssri's, I took his advice. Can't say that it helped the dizziness or made me feel any different at all but when I was in Europe and ran out, HOLY COW! I had withdrawals within a day of not taking it. This led me on a 3 year addiction to it, trying to get off it several times with no luck. So when the disequilibrium continued AND I couldn't get off the Celexa, I saw a neurologist who started me on Paxil. I asked him if the transition from Celexa to Paxil was wise and it really insulted him. "They are the same class of drugs" he reassured me. All was fine for the first 3 months but then BAM! Scary thoughts that were as invasive as hell. That was the scariest part of my ordeal and the most difficult for me to grasp. The thoughts just invaded my mind at will; I had no freakin control over it. They were so wild and scary I don't like to talk about them; the only one I ever told was my wife. After a month of this I made the connection that it might be the Paxil (before the Paxil connection I thought maybe I was going crazy, schizo, who knew???). Soooo, I talked to my regular doc (dumped the neuro) and timidly let him know what was going on, being careful not to give too much detail. His solution: UP THE DOSE OF PAXIL!!!!. I said NO WAY, how do I get off of this stuff. He said 2 week taper and I said OK!! 2 weeks of taper was as good as cold turkey to me; I had severe physical withdrawals as well as the protracted

The whole ordeal has been a nitemare for me. Not easy for a normal, unsuspecting person to have to deal with this sort of thing, but my faith in God and family has helped reaffirm why I am here.


WHEW! What a rant!!

And that's my story...hope I didn't bore you.

Tom

By the way, I've had MRI's, every hearing test imaginable and a barrage of other tests and they still can't pinpoint the dizziness. Guess I didn't need an SSRI after all huh???
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Old 08-25-2004, 09:56 AM   #11
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Don't just trust what the doctor says

My doctor told me to increase Paxil at one point. Then she also suggested Effexor. She told me there were no addiction problems with Paxil so I could keep increasing the dose (Does not addiciton mean no withdrawal... where is the fine line...).

Another doctor (more informed) told me to try and get off Paxil. She told me its not a good drug to be on...
A homeopathic doctor also told me to get off Paxil.

So... opinons vary. What worries me is that so many of these supposedly qualifed doctors don't really know what they are prescribing. From now on I try and research a medical condition from all angles and get advice from other types of health practitioners.

Imagine if we all took good care of ourselves by diet, exercise, relaxation... what would the doctors have to do? Hmmmmmmmmmmm
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Old 08-25-2004, 02:24 PM   #12
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tommy, did you have any luck with that lawfirm? i figure unless i commit suicide and then come back from the dead, i dont have a chance with them. It aggravates me that they put a cap on the number of people.
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What has happened to it all?
Crazy, some are saying
Where is the life that I recognize?
Gone away

But I won't cry for yesterday
There's an ordinary world
Somehow I have to find
And as I try to make my way
To the ordinary world
I will learn to survive



surviving an ssri reaction
alternative anxiety treatments
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Old 08-25-2004, 10:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyd
By the way, I've had MRI's, every hearing test imaginable and a barrage of other tests and they still can't pinpoint the dizziness. Guess I didn't need an SSRI after all huh???
Tom - my daughter got severe dizziness around the new year. She hardly could move her eyes.

She also had all kinds of tests, just like you. They couldn't find anything an so the docs figured it was stress. Ofcourse she was depressed with this dizziness that wouldn't let up. Yep, AD's. She tried Trazodone and Effexor XR and couldn't cope with them.

She went to a naturopathic doctor a few months ago and got several supplements. She just received the 2nd injection of B12 and she feels a lot better. Her dizziness has almost disappeared.

The weird thing is that she was diagnosed by her family doctor 3-4 years ago as having B12 deficiency and was given tablets for it.

This time nobody thought of this but this naturopath and the doc didn't even know that my daughter was deficient in the past. Blood tests can show up as normal as she was told by this doc. Injections work also far better because they go right into the bloodstream.

Well Tom, you went already through so much, why not trying vitamin B12 injections? They are not toxic and are very reasonable in cost.
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Old 08-26-2004, 02:06 AM   #14
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Tommyd,

Again, I've read about folks who have had yeast problems with the onset of the dizzy issue. You might check out curezone for this issue and do some cleanses and change the diet, taking out sugar etc. Maybe even try an elimination diet.

People just dont realize how serious this yeast fungus issue is. Most of which is being increased in our society due to the overuse of antibiotics and the overuse of them in our food supply. (IE livestock is given antibiotics) I read the other day on Mercola that 70 percent of the antibiotics produced are used in our livestock...Then we eat grains and sugar and ferment......


Darlene
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Old 08-26-2004, 02:15 AM   #15
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I was a mess yesterday.... Couldn't stop crying, looking at how I got here and how the medical establishment in the country sucks... Anyway at the height of my crying jag, I don't know why but I shot off another email to Dr. Tracy. So here it is..




Well you will have to stand in line for the screaming and crying and being angry with the drug companies and it is a VERY LONG line!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You certainly have reason to scream and cry and be angry! I would too in your place. I do anyway because I see so many people go through this and then they try to blame it all on the patient!

They are using that withdrawal depression to keep my little 15 year old neighbor on Zoloft now and I am SO MAD about it that it is a good thing I do not know who the doctor is because I would be getting arrested for making a scene in his office right now!

The eye thing really caught my attention. I think we might be able to do something with this. You are the third person I have talked to in the past couple of months to experience that on these drugs. One of those is a doctor or was a doctor before these drugs screwed up his life. I think I need to get the three of you together and have you sue the manufacturers for this.

What part of the country are you in and are you planning on coming to the FDA hearing in September . . .

In a message dated 8/25/2004 11:02:39 AM Mountain Daylight Time, DAR7726@aol.com writes:



Sorry to write you so soon again Dr. Tracy. And I promise to make this the last for a while.

But I'm so angry with these damn drug co's I don't know whether to scream or cry. And the Medical community at large.

I've was on AD's for 18 years and was told I'd have to stay on them the rest of my life. It was like insulin for a diabetic. And of course you know when you miss a dose and you feel depressed or whatever it convinces you that it is so.

But I was on Antibiotics (tetracycoline) for acne for 8 years prior and that probably caused my depression. But going to the doctors to get help, of couse did not. Cause no one knew.

Now I've lost my job, was in the hospital twice, had to have eye surgery about 1 1/2 years ago, which I think was caused by the drugs. Retina detachment in one eye and holes in the other. Then I had a psycotic break after, the surgery, with additional antibiotics and the AD's
Lost my job. Then back to the hospital.

I've gone through my savings and now had to take out my 401K money to live....Now I'm trying to regain my health. Can't sleep, aches and pains etc.

Go after them Dr. Tracy cause no one should have to endure this. Crying now.

Sorry to bother you.
Darlene
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Old 08-26-2004, 05:35 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dar7726
Dr. Tracy, I'm sorry to be a bother. I have so many questions and there is just no one to ask who is an expert. I do have your CD's but it does not address these issues. I'm a frequent poster on the http://www.paxilprogress.org/ site and there are lots of questions as to what to do to help us during withdrawal. Some folks have done liver, gallbladder and colonex and ended up worse. Others say exercise makes them worse.

I. for one have been off these drugs only 4 months. The muscle, joint pain and insomnia is the worse. It seems to have gotten worse in just the last few days with adding the rebounder/exercises. The rebounder is good for your adrenals I hear which are shot from taking these drugs. Its so hard to know what to do. Detox or not, exercise or not. And I guess I should really get the oils.

Any other suggestions, if you have the time. I know you are a very busy woman.

Darlene
That's definitly something I'd like to know, too.
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Old 08-26-2004, 08:07 AM   #17
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Hi guys,


Thanks for the feedback! I take any suggestions I can!


Scott: Yes, I contacted Baum Hedlund. Because I am in Michigan, I was told there is not much I can do because a law was passed last year protecting the drug companies in Michigan from people like me. I did have a long talk with one of the lead lawyers and he did feel my pain. I also contacted a lawyer out on the west coast (got her name here) and she said there is possibly a case, but I didn't report the severe adverse reactions I was having when they were happening. I did review my records for the one visit with my doc where I timidly told him I didn't feel "right" and he did write in the report that "patient seems to be doing well but is experiencing increased anxiety". Dunno if that'll fly in court or not. Recently on my visits to the doc I have been much more open about my experience, hoping they will document my comments.

Dar: I'll stand in that long line too if it gives any vindication for all of us who have suffered (many needlessly!!).

As for the vitamin B issue: I'm for Vit B but I can stand here and tell you that when I take the B complex supplements, I notice increased anxiety. I've been trying to stay clear of them. Will injections have a similar effect?

Tom
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Old 08-26-2004, 10:24 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyd

As for the vitamin B issue: I'm for Vit B but I can stand here and tell you that when I take the B complex supplements, I notice increased anxiety. I've been trying to stay clear of them. Will injections have a similar effect?

Tom - Vitamin B12 is a single vitamin only and not a compound.

Deficiency in Vitamin B12 causes:

Chronic Fatigue
Constipation
Depression
Digestive Disorders
Dizziness
Eye disorders
Hallucinations
Laboured breathing
Irritability
Memory loss
Moodiness
Nervousness
Palpitations
Ringing in the ears
Pernicious anemia

Some people cannot metabolize vitamin B12 in the gut. That's why injections are usually given.

Hope this explains it more.
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Old 08-26-2004, 11:22 AM   #19
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Thanks Elisa!

How do I go about trying it? Should I see a holistic doc? I'm kind of afraid of the fees, but if there's relief to be found, I'll take a loan out to do it!

I just had a barrage of blood tests and everything was normal, even thyroid. Should they have checked for Vit B dificiencies?

Tom
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Old 08-26-2004, 11:34 AM   #20
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Tom - I don't know about the medical situation in your country. Usually, the yearly check-ups do not include a test for B12 deficiency and sometimes the test comes out normal while it is not.

My daughter is going to a naturopathic doctor who charges her $16.00 CDN per vial (good for 10 injections) and $5.00 per visit to give her the shot. She has a shot 1x per week.(1 cc)

If she would visit her family doctor, and providing he would give her the shots, it would be covered by her insurance plan.

Hope this helps.
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Old 08-26-2004, 07:22 PM   #21
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Dr. Tracy sent me another email.... I thought I'd share it with you.. It is in response to the fact that others also suffered the eye damage that I did. I've edited it to take out the guys email address and phone number.

Here it is.
Rick Eastburn called this morning and told me to send you his e-mail address and phone number. He really wants to talk with you. He just had more hyperbaric treatments that did WONDERS for his eye!!!

His e-mail is ...........and phone number...........


He is calling Dr. Hanna who has the same problem right now to tell him about how much the hyperbaric helped him
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Old 08-26-2004, 07:23 PM   #22
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Oh and I found out from Kybobbi that the doctor I'm going to see in September has a hyperberic chamber..... How cool is that....


Darlene
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Old 09-01-2004, 10:08 AM   #23
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Responding to the various "P" problems. Withdrawal

Dear Darlene:

I am so thankful for finding this website. God bless you. It is horrible that we were put on this hellish drug!!! I too got in touch with Dr. Tracey and she is a Godsnd for us. I am a 65 year old grandma who was battling some physical ailments, such as Vertigo. For about 2 months, Then a urinary tract infection and finally bronchitis. Nothing compared the physical trauma you are enduring. My heart goes out to you. My doc, put me on Paxil. In just two and a half months I began waking up at nite with severe heat and sweats. She laughed and said your just having menaupausal systoms again. I didn't laugh and said I wanted off the Paxil. I had also got on the website and found Dr. Tracey. I told her about Dr. Tracey and Paxil. She did't like the information given by Dr. Tracey. If I wouldn't do as she said, I should get in touch with my internet Doctor, Dr. Tracey. she said. I'm no longer her patient.
Sorry for going on for so long. I am now seeing a Holistic Doc. He's very
understanding. We so need to feel connected to others during this. That's
one of my symptoms, That isolated feeling, horrible anxiety, depressing,
which I hadn't felt until Paxil. I was only on it for 3 and a months and tried weaning down and it took another 2 and a half months. Been off for
4 months now and It's been slow going. the B12 injections didn't seem to help me. I took 5 injections. No appetite, I've lost 25 lbs. Didn't want to do it this way tho. I'm living on the Power Meal Dr. Tracey suggested.
I'm new on this sight and please forgive me it I just went on and on.
Just call me Grandma Fay. My love goes out to all you dear people.
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Old 09-01-2004, 10:17 AM   #24
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Welcome grandma Fay.... You post away... We are here for you...



Darlene
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